From owner-crossfire Tue Oct 1 03:31:02 1996 Return-Path: Received: from spy.org ([198.232.139.1]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Tue, 1 Oct 1996 03:31:00 +0200 Received: from security.spy.org by spy.org (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id TAA13317; Mon, 30 Sep 1996 19:28:56 -0600 Received: by security.spy.org (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id TAA02438; Mon, 30 Sep 1996 19:24:44 -0600 Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 19:24:44 -0600 From: scott@spy.org (Scott D. Yelich) Message-Id: <199610010124.TAA02438@security.spy.org> To: crossfire-announce@ifi.uio.no, mwedel@pyramid.com Subject: Re: Crossfire 0.92.7 released Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-MD5: 0/Sf9iFPGJ40hRdvponkLQ== Status: RO is there any support for compiling crossfire with gcc and cde? ie: no xmkmf or imake. Scott From owner-crossfire Mon Sep 30 10:57:58 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Mon, 30 Sep 1996 10:57:58 +0200 Received: from nexus.astro.psu.edu (nexus.astro.psu.edu [128.118.147.20]) by ifi.uio.no with SMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Mon, 30 Sep 1996 10:57:52 +0200 Received: from zaphod.astro.psu.edu by nexus.astro.psu.edu (4.1/Nexus-1.3) id AA02345; Mon, 30 Sep 96 04:57:30 EDT Received: by zaphod.astro.psu.edu (4.1/Client-1.3) id AA13186; Mon, 30 Sep 96 04:56:32 EDT Date: Mon, 30 Sep 96 04:56:32 EDT From: "Brian Thomas" Message-Id: <9609300856.AA13186@zaphod.astro.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: mwedel@pyramid.com Subject: CF: minor bug fix Cc: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO The new use of the changing flag screws up the throwing code. Basically, it winds up producing 2 copys of an object if you throw an is_changing object (BAD!). The fix is easy, and included below. -b.t. *** ../../tarfiles/crossfire-0.92.6/server/skills.c Thu Sep 19 06:26:39 1996 --- ./skills.c Mon Sep 30 04:52:27 1996 *************** *** 42,51 **** --- 42,53 ---- #include #include #include #include + #define DEBUG_THROW + /* * When stealing: dependent on the intelligence/wisdom of whom you're * stealing from (op in attempt_steal), offset by your dexterity and * skill at stealing. They may notice your attempt, whether successful * or not. *************** *** 1144,1153 **** --- 1146,1156 ---- if(orig) { toss_item=get_object(); copy_object(orig,toss_item); toss_item->type = THROWN_OBJ; + if(QUERY_FLAG(toss_item,FLAG_CHANGING)) CLEAR_FLAG(toss_item,FLAG_CHANGING); toss_item->stats.dam = 0; /* default damage */ #ifdef DEBUG_THROW LOG(llevDebug," inserting %s(%d) in toss_item(%d)\n", orig->name,orig->count,toss_item->count); #endif From owner-crossfire Mon Sep 30 23:45:39 1996 Return-Path: Received: from mne.ifi.uio.no (1232@mne.ifi.uio.no [129.240.70.5]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Mon, 30 Sep 1996 23:45:38 +0200 Received: (from kjetilho@localhost) by mne.ifi.uio.no ; Mon, 30 Sep 1996 23:45:35 +0200 Message-Id: <199609302145.12892.mne.ifi.uio.no@ifi.uio.no> From: "Mark Wedel" Sender: kjetilho Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 00:14:23 -0700 To: crossfire-announce@ifi.uio.no Subject: Crossfire 0.92.7 released Status: RO There are several changes in 0.92.7. The main functional change would be the throwing code. There are several smaller improvements/changes to existing code, plus a decent number of bugfixes. Hopefully, this version is more stable than 0.92.6 (I did fix all reproducible bugs that would crash the game.) So on to the real release information: There are four separate tar archives in the Crossfire 0.92.7 distribution: sums (bsd) filename 61603 731 crossfire-0.92.7.arch.tar.gz 08502 724 crossfire-0.92.7.doc.tar.gz 32350 1897 crossfire-0.92.7.maps.tar.gz 05006 310 crossfire-0.92.7.sounds.tar.gz 29012 1826 crossfire-0.92.7.tar.gz crossfire-0.92.7.tar.gz contains the actual program code. See the CHANGES file in this archive for everything that has changed. It also contains pre-made archetypes and image files (along with postscript spoiler and handbook), so that the crossfire-0.92.7.arch.tar.gz file is not needed. crossfire-0.92.7.arch.tar.gz contains the unpacked archetype (arch) directory. This file is not needed if you just want to compile the games and play. The contents of this archive is used to create the archetypes, bmaps, font, and X PixMap (XPM) files You only need it if you want to add new archetypes, mess around with the existing ones, or recreate some files. You also need this if you want to create the images for the html versions of the playbook and handbook, but read the notes about the doc archive below. Changes for 0.92.7: weight updated for some monsters, a couple new players added, throwing archetypes added, and editable flag set properly on many objects. crossfire-0.92.7.doc.tar.gz: This contains all the preformatted documentation from the doc directory (really, everything there is.) What you get is postscript versions of the spoiler and handbook, along with html versions WITH all images premade (this is the only archive that has the GIF images premade). What you don't get is the source code for the latex spoiler and handbook. If you just play the game but would like full documentation, this is the archive to get. Everything in here can be recreated if with tar and arch archives. crossfire-0.92.7.maps.tar.gz contains all the maps. Main changes are updates for the lighting code, some buggy maps fixed up. crossfire-0.92.7.sounds.tar.gz: This is an updated sound archive. There are few changes from the last (0.89.3 I believe). I added a couple for lightning effect. You only need this if you are playing with sound effects. There is not a new client package or new eutl package - there have not been any changes since 0.92.4. FOR FIRST TIME USERS: You will need the crossfire-0.92.7.tar.gz and crossfire-0.92.7.maps.tar.gz file. You do not need the crossfire-0.92.7.arch.tar.gz file. If you just want to play the game at some remote server and have no interesting in compiling it, you may then want to get the crossfire-0.92.7.doc.tar.gz file. If you have sound capability and want sounds, also get the crossfire-0.92.7.sounds.tar.gz file. Crossfire is available on the following ftp sites Primary: ra.pyramid.com:/pub/crossfire (129.214.1.102) ftp.ifi.uio.no:/pub/crossfire (129.240.82.2) Secondary: ftp.real-time.com:/pub/games/crossfire (206.10.252.1) yoyo.cc.monash.edu.au:/pub/crossfire (130.194.9.1) ftp.cs.city.ac.uk:/pub/games/crossfire/ ftp.sunet.se:/pub/unix/games/crossfire (130.238.127.3) ftp.cs.titech.ac.jp:/pub/games/crossfire I uploaded this version to just ra. It should be on ftp.ifi by the time you get this message, and on the other servers a short time after that. Mark Wedel mwedel@pyramid.com 9/29/96 From owner-crossfire Fri Sep 27 13:17:48 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Fri, 27 Sep 1996 13:17:48 +0200 Received: from doomsday.iam.uni-bonn.de (root@rhrz-ts3-p12.rhrz.uni-bonn.de [131.220.224.142]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Fri, 27 Sep 1996 13:17:32 +0200 Received: (from tgm@localhost) by doomsday.iam.uni-bonn.de (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA00425; Fri, 27 Sep 1996 13:14:22 +0200 From: Thomas Ackermann Message-Id: <199609271114.NAA00425@doomsday.iam.uni-bonn.de> Subject: CF: lost original subject ... Mime-Version: 1.0 To: thomas@xplorer.gsfc.nasa.go, crossfire@ifi.uio.no Date: Fri, 27 Sep 1996 13:14:21 +0200 (MET DST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Brian Thomas wrote: > I have been putting together some ideas about the combat > system which I would like to share for critical discussion. > Some of this stuff I have already mentioned in earlier email, > so ardent readers of this list should recognize many of these > ideas. The framework which I am presenting below, is however, > very new. > > As always, changes should be implemented with the idea of > 'fun' first, realism second. > -b.t. I have had only a short look over your proposal (ever played GURPS? ;-) and cannot commend about the single ideas and effects, but the whole idea just hits me fully! CF was always *nice*, i though, but i never realy played it - *exactly* your idea could be something that enhanced CF to a more Roleplaying-like game. You do not bash some stats against each other until one or the other dies, but have the possibility to realy *act* within the game-world! I realy love it! Problem maybe beeing, that this kind of combat needs alot of more intelligence for the computer-creatures ... Otherwise, you could use tactics that are much too efficient against them. Thanx for your mail, and Byebye, -- Thomas (tgm) Ackermann | G i b GATES | DOS* |Great minds tja ;-) Tel. 0228/73-7773 | 631369 | k e i n e | WIN* |discuss ideas (e-mail: tgm@rhein.iam.uni-bonn.de) | C h a n c e ! | WIN95|-------------- -----------------------------------------------------------------|Average minds mail a sole "help" and/or "add discuss-l" line (in mail-body) to |discuss events listserv@math.uni-bonn.de to be added to a list were you can |-------------- talk about non-GURPS related things with people from GURPSnet-L |Small minds -----------------------------------------------------------------|discuss people From owner-crossfire Fri Sep 27 08:59:03 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Fri, 27 Sep 1996 08:59:03 +0200 Received: from nexus.astro.psu.edu (nexus.astro.psu.edu [128.118.147.20]) by ifi.uio.no with SMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Fri, 27 Sep 1996 08:58:58 +0200 Received: from zaphod.astro.psu.edu by nexus.astro.psu.edu (4.1/Nexus-1.3) id AA17053; Fri, 27 Sep 96 02:59:51 EDT Received: by zaphod.astro.psu.edu (4.1/Client-1.3) id AA27114; Fri, 27 Sep 96 02:58:53 EDT Date: Fri, 27 Sep 96 02:58:53 EDT From: "Brian Thomas" Message-Id: <9609270658.AA27114@zaphod.astro.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: CF: minor patch to attack.c Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO In the throwing patch, there is a small fix to use query_name in the messages concerning who killed who. Apparently, this messes up things for a reason I dont fully understand. At any rate, the messaging isnt important to the throwing (or any) patch. Here is a 'patch' to remove this messaging from attack.c and restore it to normal. -b.t. *** attack.c.orig Fri Sep 27 02:55:44 1996 --- attack.c Fri Sep 27 02:55:52 1996 *************** *** 739,768 **** owner=hitter; /* Player killed something */ if(owner->type==PLAYER&&(owner->level/2level||op->stats.exp>1000)) { if(owner!=hitter) { ! (void) sprintf(buf,"You killed %s with %s.",query_name(op) ! ,query_name(hitter)); #ifdef ALLOW_SKILLS old_hitter = hitter; owner->exp_obj=hitter->exp_obj; #endif } else ! (void) sprintf(buf,"You killed %s.",query_name(op)); #ifdef SOUND_EFFECTS play_sound_map(owner->map, owner->x, owner->y, SOUND_PLAYER_KILLS); #endif new_draw_info(NDI_BLACK, 0,owner,buf); if(op->type == PLAYER && hitter != op) change_luck(hitter, -1); } /* Pet killed something. */ if(get_owner(hitter)!=NULL) { ! (void) sprintf(buf,"%s killed %s with %s.",hitter->owner->name, ! query_name(op),query_name(hitter)); #ifdef ALLOW_SKILLS old_hitter = hitter; owner->exp_obj=hitter->exp_obj; #endif hitter=hitter->owner; --- 739,767 ---- owner=hitter; /* Player killed something */ if(owner->type==PLAYER&&(owner->level/2level||op->stats.exp>1000)) { if(owner!=hitter) { ! (void) sprintf(buf,"You killed %s with %s.",op->name,hitter->name); #ifdef ALLOW_SKILLS old_hitter = hitter; owner->exp_obj=hitter->exp_obj; #endif } else ! (void) sprintf(buf,"You killed %s.",op->name); #ifdef SOUND_EFFECTS play_sound_map(owner->map, owner->x, owner->y, SOUND_PLAYER_KILLS); #endif new_draw_info(NDI_BLACK, 0,owner,buf); if(op->type == PLAYER && hitter != op) change_luck(hitter, -1); } /* Pet killed something. */ if(get_owner(hitter)!=NULL) { ! (void) sprintf(buf,"%s killed %s with %s.",hitter->owner->name,op->name, ! hitter->name); #ifdef ALLOW_SKILLS old_hitter = hitter; owner->exp_obj=hitter->exp_obj; #endif hitter=hitter->owner; *************** *** 1184,1200 **** owner=get_owner(hitter); if(owner==NULL) owner=hitter; if(owner->type==PLAYER&&(owner->level/2level||op->stats.exp>1000)) { if(owner!=hitter) { ! (void) sprintf(buf,"You killed %s with %s.",query_name(op),query_name(hitter)); #ifdef ALLOW_SKILLS old_hitter = hitter; owner->exp_obj=hitter->exp_obj; #endif } else ! (void) sprintf(buf,"You killed %s.",query_name(op)); #ifdef SOUND_EFFECTS play_sound_map(owner->map, owner->x, owner->y, SOUND_PLAYER_KILLS); #endif new_draw_info(NDI_BLACK, 0,owner,buf); if(op->type == PLAYER && hitter != op) --- 1183,1199 ---- owner=get_owner(hitter); if(owner==NULL) owner=hitter; if(owner->type==PLAYER&&(owner->level/2level||op->stats.exp>1000)) { if(owner!=hitter) { ! (void) sprintf(buf,"You killed %s with %s.",op->name,hitter->name); #ifdef ALLOW_SKILLS old_hitter = hitter; owner->exp_obj=hitter->exp_obj; #endif } else ! (void) sprintf(buf,"You killed %s.",op->name); #ifdef SOUND_EFFECTS play_sound_map(owner->map, owner->x, owner->y, SOUND_PLAYER_KILLS); #endif new_draw_info(NDI_BLACK, 0,owner,buf); if(op->type == PLAYER && hitter != op) From owner-crossfire Thu Sep 26 21:10:16 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Thu, 26 Sep 1996 21:10:16 +0200 Received: from xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov [128.183.126.216]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Thu, 26 Sep 1996 21:10:11 +0200 Received: (from thomas@localhost) by xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (LHEA9504/950407.s1) id PAA08835 for crossfire@ifi.uio.no; Thu, 26 Sep 1996 15:09:27 -0400 Date: Thu, 26 Sep 1996 15:09:27 -0400 From: Brian Thomas Message-Id: <199609261909.PAA08835@xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: CF: Combat proposal, reponses... Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Wow. Lots of responses about the combat proposal! Nice to see :) Unfortunately, there are too many for me to respond individually, so here's my (long!) "group" response, sorted by subject. -b.t. FATIGUE: > IF you just do normal attacks, will you be hit by fatigue, or is it only > normal attacks? I would expect fatigue can be lost in 4 ways: - making a 'special' attack - getting hit in combat - by casting incantations. - moving with too heavy of a load We could add the '5th' case of 'normal' combat too. I would think that in this case the fp cost to be fairly low, something like your movement fatigue cost+1. This would then make it important for a player to not go around fighting 'fully loaded'. Under this system, you can still do it, but its going to be a very desperate/bad idea. :) As for wizards casting spells (which was unmentioned before), fatigue cost would be based on the spell being cast versus the caster's level, I would expect a formula like: fp cost = mana cost * (spell level/caster level). So high level wizards need very little effort to cast the lower level spells. If you run out of fatigue, then you are too exhausted to cast a spell!. No fp cost would be assessed for clerical magic. > I would suggest a close connection between hp and fatigue. The "hp" are > something silimiar anyway: If a character with 2 of 150 hp's left For now, I would like to leave this (largely) alone. I prefer the character losing fp equal to the hp (damage) for every blow inflicted on the player/npc. > I would suggest that Con be factored in along with physique experience for > fatigue calculations. AFter all, a starting character with a 20 con should Yeah, this makes sense to me. REPAIRING ARMOUR/WEAPONS: > The fact that the only way to fully repair magical armor is via the scrolls > more or less means magic armor isn't really repaired (just recreated). This > would seem to weaken the fighters viability some (or usefulness of items - I would avocate that the magic value of the armour/weapon *doesnt* decrease. Only the wc/ac value does. When the item breaks, then we have just (non-magical) shards! but until then the item retains its magical properties w/o loss. > I favor multiple anvil types (or higher required smithing Yes! this sounds good. How about sorting the repairs by material so that you find in the shops: "needle and thread" - repairs cloth, leather armour like boots, gloves, shoes, girdles, etc. "hammer and saw" - repairs wooden items like the small sheild. "iron anvil" - fixes iron items like gauntlets, iron sheilds, platemail, swords, axes, etc. "enchanted anvil" - fixes adamantite items like ?? (artifacts?) AND We could introduce new skills: "sewing", "woodworking" (carpentry?) and "metalsmith" to handle the repair of various items (and co-opt the weapon ident abilities currently handled by "smithery" which we could eliminate). I suppose there might be a "bonesmith" and or "stonesmith" skills out there for the trolls :). Would the players have such skills!? DAMAGING ARMOUR/WEAPONS: > or weapon/armor damage, I would suggest using saving throw tables/code. > After all, a wood club going against metal armor is much more likely to be > damaged than a metal sword. Likewise, leather is more likely to be cut apart > than full plate. Yeah, this seems pretty good too. Here's a sketch of how we could handle the weapon/armour damaging process: 1) assess whether weapon will damage the armour. if not, 2) assess whether the armour damaged the weapon. Formulae for determining breakage would involve a lookup table modifier (Mod, see below) based on the 'main' materials used in the armour, weapon items and the force of the blow which is basically the damage inflicted by the weapon in that particular attack (ie dam=RANDOM()%weap_ob->stats.dam): Weapon (weap_ob) breaking armour (arm_ob): % chance = dam * [ (2*Mod) - 0.5*(arm_ob->magic - weap_ob->magic) ] Armour breaking a weapon: % chance = dam * [ (0.5*Mod) + 0.5*(arm_ob->magic - weap_ob->magic) ] So its clear that its easier for a weapon to damage a piece of armour than the other way around. On the other hand, we should make armour repair cheaper/easier to obtain than weapon repair. TABLE of modifiers, for 2 things 'attacking' each other: ATACKING | DEFENDING MATERIAL MATERIAL | | Gls Org Ppr Cth Lea Bne Wod Stn Irn Adm | ------------------------------------------------------ cloth/paper| 0.5 0.2 0.2 0.1 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 | leather | 0.5 0.3 0.2 0.1 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 | organic | 0.6 0.4 0.2 0.2 0.1 0.1 0.1 0.0 0.0 0.0 | glass | 1.0 2.0 2.0 1.0 0.3 0.1 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 | bone | 2.0 1.5 1.5 0.5 0.3 0.2 0.2 0.1 0.0 0.0 | wood | 2.2 1.0 0.5 0.3 0.2 0.2 0.2 0.1 0.1 0.0 | stone | 2.5 1.5 1.0 0.5 0.4 0.3 0.2 0.1 0.1 0.0 | iron | 3.0 2.0 1.5 1.0 0.8 0.6 0.4 0.3 0.2 0.1 | adamantite | 4.0 3.5 3.0 2.0 1.6 1.2 0.8 0.6 0.4 0.2 | ------------------------------------------------------ In the above table I have added the (needed) material type of "BONE" (which could incl. 'sharp' stuff like 'claws' and organic means something like 'muscle'). We could expand the table to include 'BRONZE' and 'STEEL', 'GOLD/SILVER', etc. if desired. Remember the effects of 'damaging' are: weapon: lose 1 wc up to maximum limit of original wc+magic armour: lose 1 ac up to maximum limit of original ac+magic Basically, when the ac+magic+orig ac is *negative* the armour destructs. No subtration from the magic value is done. Here's some examples: * iron mace attacking wood shield, mace dam=10: -chance to damage armour: 4% -chance to damage weapon: 0% * +3 iron axe attacking +1 wood shield, axe dam=10: -chance to damage armour: 18% -chance to damage weapon: 0% * +1 iron axe attacking +4 bone shield, axe dam=10: -chance to damage armour: 0% -chance to damage weapon: 0% and so on...you can see that having those magical bonuses *really* helps. BLEEDING/STUCK IMPALING WEAPONS: > I would submit that a weapon can be stuck even if armour > does not exist. Consider a spear (especially barbed) stuck in Yes, I agree. > Also, what did you have in mind as far as weapons being > stuck, particularly non-wielded weapons such as arrows and > thrown spears? Perhaps to add them into the inventory of > the victim in a way alike to "cursed", unremovable until > ripped out (extra damage) or with medical skill? Yes. Exactly what I was thinking! ATTACKMODE==>ATTACKTYPES: First off..After giving it a little thinking time, It seems that the "attack modes" are best handled as just new "attacktypes". Therefore, ANY attack can be classified as impale, chop, bash, etc. This would make it *very* trivial (just edit the spellarchs) to add these new attack types to spells. For example, we could add the "bash" attacktype to a "fireball" spell so that the target may be blown back by the initial impact. as another example, magic missle might have an "impale" attack. > How about dig type attacks against (golems, living statues, > earth elementals) and their ilk? Sure. But, heh, how do you get a victim to stay still long enough to "dig" it? :) I see "dig" as an attacktype that will occur only when you make a special attack versus an "empty" square, OR a breakable wall, OR cast a spell with the dig attacktype that 'detonates' in that square (eg the "bomb" spell would leave a crater!). ATTACK MANUEVERS: > In Omega, any physical attack (i.e. one delivered by weapon) is delivered > over one of three attack lines: high, medium, or low. Blocking is also > constrained to those levels. If a monster attacks high while you're > blocking high you have a chance to block the blow. To change the way you > attack and block, you use the F command, within which you get to arrange AND > Idea: Let the player set one or two parameters: > two: Aggressive - Defensive, Melee - Technical OR: > one: Aggressive - Technical. My first response (from playing omega) is that this isnt much fun in the long run. Once you have figured all of the monsters out, it amounts to just a formality before you fight. On the other hand, I think you (both) are right to point out that there are different objectives/manevers for every combat. Therefore, I would like to introduce the concept of "attack manuevers": An attack manuever would be the way in which you are using the weapon. Manuevers would include: - swing : swing the weapon in an arc - stab/thrust : forward in/out quick motion - parry : use the weapon to *exclusively* parry attacks made on the wielder - feint : fake an attack at an area so as to open up another one. High fatigue cost, but more likely to succeed. Fp cost of attack mult by 1 1/2. These manuevers would appear as "buttons" in the stat-bar window. You could select a manuver either by pressing a button or by issuing the command 'use_skill melee (if is ommitted, current readied weapon is default). Above the manuever buttons we would have a picture of the weapon being used. Thus, if you are using 2 weapon skill, you see 2 weapon archs, and press the weapon displayed to toggle the display of the manuever buttons, that show what your manuever is on that weapon. The attacktype (and effect) of the weapon is dependant on the manuever. Consider the following table: Attack | Weapon has attacktype: manuever | |Impale| Cut | Chop | Bash | Pick | Dig |Disarm|"None" ------------------------------------------------------------- swing | ---- | CUT | CHOP | BASH | IMPL | DIG | ---- | norm thrust | IMPL | ---- | ---- | ---- | ---- | DIG | ---- | norm parry | PRY- | PRY | PRY | PRY | PRY- | ---- | PRY | PRY- feint | IMPL | CUT | CHOP | BASH | IMP- | ---- | DSRM | norm ("pick" attacktype is for picks, war-hammers; "None" attacktype is for things with no special attacktype like chair, magnifier.) Now, the table entries mean: norm 'special' attack is the "normal" attack ---- No special attack is allowed, perhaps we make less than effective normal attack (?) IF some other attacktype (that can use this manuever) isnt present in the weapon. BASH bashing attack is made. CHOP chopping attack is made. CUT cutting attack is made. DIG digging attack is made. DSRM disarming attack is made. IMPL impaling attack is made. IMP- impaling attack is made, but with a less effective than normal chance to hit (and even higher fatigue cost). PRY parrying PRY- parrying, but less effective than normal So if you have a weapon with *both* the Cut and Impale attack types (aka "sword"), if you use the "swing" manuever you will make a cutting attack, if you use a "thrust" manuever you will make a impaling attack. In the case of a "feint" we make either an impale *or* cutting attack (randomly chosen by code; in a feint, you can't be sure of what you'll get in this case). EXTENDED WEAPONS: > Hopefully an implementation flexible enough to handle more > than one length (length 2 in your example) of weapon could For now, weapons will only be "extended" (one addtional) square) or not extended (normal). Having longer stuff leads to serious implementation problems I dont want to face. :) > attacked square) weapons only, I would think that one could attack >"knight's move" squares in this fashion, given that diagonal Well, the main reason I would disagree with allowing this is that it would be quite difficult to implement in a straitforward way. How does the player indicate to the server to make an attack in a "knights move" square? Other attacks are just from trying to move into the square, seems like something different would be called for here (since you currently cant make a "knights move" as a player). > and to "set" weapons against a charge. > Someone charging would gain damage bonuses of some > sort, someone charging into a "set" weapon would > _experience_ said damage bonuses. Lines of set pikes. Ouch. Yes! this sounds good. I would allow a "braced" player to have "set" their weapon. This means no turning as well for the "braced" player. > It would be nice to be able to shuffle left/right > (relative to your forward-facing direction) while maintaining such > a weapon. Alas, we have only 8+center/here+up+down directions, > and don't have "turn left/right" directions, which could allow > simultaneously your sensible idea of having to turn with the > weapon. Any thoughts as to how to have both? > > Perhaps diagonal directions could be co-opted. Directional > movement would translate as "shuffle left/right", whereas > movement to the left/right (relative to facing) would act > as you specify. Or maybe the reverse seems more natural... I like your "diagonal" scheme. Ill try to implement that. From owner-crossfire Tue Sep 24 21:25:27 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Tue, 24 Sep 1996 21:25:27 +0200 Received: from hh-tig.csh.uiuc.edu (iavramov@hh-tig.csh.uiuc.edu [128.174.165.214]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Tue, 24 Sep 1996 21:25:20 +0200 Received: (from iavramov@localhost) by hh-tig.csh.uiuc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.9) id OAA02224; Tue, 24 Sep 1996 14:27:27 -0500 Message-Id: <199609241927.OAA02224@hh-tig.csh.uiuc.edu> Subject: Re: CF: combat proposal (long) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: tgm@math.uni-bonn.de (Thomas Ackermann) Date: Tue, 24 Sep 1996 14:27:27 -0500 (CDT) Cc: crossfire@ifi.uio.no In-Reply-To: <199609231431.207.mne.ifi.uio.no@ifi.uio.no> from "Thomas Ackermann" at Sep 23, 96 01:47:20 pm From: Ivan Avramovic X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 958 Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO > It seems, you are happy with very few things - kind of minimalist ... Well, you're right, that's probably true. One of CF's strengths is that it has so much stuff in it (monsters, items, skills, etc). I'd like to see some effort put on making the most of what is already there in addition to expanding the game. > What you propose it *no* change to the combat-system, but simply a little change > in the environment - and to be honest, i believe, that such "dramatic strings" > are over-read very fast ... Well, I can't imagine that adding strings would *hurt* gameplay. At the worst, you would just ignore them (like I do with the current strings). The only significant cost would be the effort spent creating them. Plus, I do think it would spice things up a bit, so it wouldn't hurt... Oh, and for the record, I'm all for trying the enhanced combat system. I'm just throwing in an additional solution (they aren't mutually exclusive). -Ivan From owner-crossfire Thu Sep 26 00:14:22 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Thu, 26 Sep 1996 00:14:22 +0200 Received: from ue801di.lrz-muenchen.de (root@dial154.ppp.lrz-muenchen.de [129.187.24.154]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Thu, 26 Sep 1996 00:13:40 +0200 Received: (from fb@localhost) by ue801di.lrz-muenchen.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id EAA06417 for crossfire@ifi.uio.no; Tue, 24 Sep 1996 04:14:23 -0700 From: Florian Beck Message-Id: <199609241114.EAA06417@ue801di.lrz-muenchen.de> Subject: Re: CF: combat proposal (long) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Date: Tue, 24 Sep 1996 04:14:23 -0700 (MST) Reply-To: h729ihqu@sun1.cip.fak14.uni-muenchen.de X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 10643 Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Hello! First of all: CF really is great! And the weapon code modifications sound even better. So please, don't missunderstand any of my comments/suggestions. It's not for me even to think about coding things like that myself... Brian Thomas wrote: > I. Weapon attack modes ... > cut low 1-Attacks cause bleeding to occur > and Mult all damage that penetrates > armour by 1 1/3. A cutting attack shoud less likely penetrate armour. ... > Cut -- Nothing beyond initial damage check. I'd suggest a high chance for blade weapons to be damaged when trying to cut armour. ... > Disarm -- NO initial damage check. When I'm trying "disarm" and don't succeed - probably my AC should be lowered? [Idea: I'm doing something very non-defensive.] AND: Chance should depend on opponents weapon/attack style. It should work less likely against someone bashing with heavy weapons than fencing with a rapier. ... > If a weapon/armour item accumulates a negative ac/wc "bonus" greater > than its magic bonus, it is destroyed. This means that an ordinary > small shield (ac 1) is destroyed after accumulating 2 damaging hits > (ac first goes to "0", on next hit it then becomes negative) and a > +1 small shield can take 3 hits. A piece of armour is also destroyed > if its armour value drops below 0. I know it would be difficult but I would prefer a new veriable. It would indicate if it is damaged or not (100%=perfect condition,0%=can't even be fixed anymore). For the time being wc/ac/damage could be multiplied with the "quality" (a 50% damage+10 weapon would do +5 damage). Spice could be added: low quality weapons are less likely to succeed with special attacks. > b. how to 'invoke' special attacks > > Under some attack modes several effects are listed. For a first > pass at coding this, each effect listed is checked for in every > attack. Later, we may think of an easy, intuitive way to allow the > wielder to select the special attack effect. > > The player invokes a special attack by readying the melee weapons > skill, and making a 'ranged' attack. Monsters may make special > attacks based on their intelligence, attack movement, and whether > they have the skill_melee_weapons in their inventory. Idea: Let the player set one or two parameters: two: Aggressive - Defensive, Melee - Technical OR: one: Aggressive - Technical. Depending on these paramteres, the wielded weapon and the stats, the special attack os chosen: - an aggressive style is chosen: if the character has high STR and say a warhammer - fine: lots of bash attacks; if he has low STR or e.g a rapier/dagger - bad: lots of misses - same with technical style: high INT/DEX and rapier/nunchacu/taifu - many impaling and disarming attacks, else - failures... > c. immunities. > > Of course, some monsters will be immune to some or all of these > attack modes, and may be unaffected by bleeding and fatigue. > For players, some magical items may make the user immune to some > attack modes and reduce or (in rare and REALLY powerful items) > eliminate the effects of fatigue and/or bleeding. Seems all monster archetypes have to be changed. (Fine, there are other things which could be done.) First I though "impale" should not work against ghosts. But then: what attack can hurt ghosts at all? > > Some player character types may not be affected by bleeding (cf. > fireborn and wraith). Hmm, either bleeding is only a small nuicance or these type would gain a HUGE advantage. (Neven liked those anyway: they can't be seen as professions.) > II. Fatigue and Bleeding. > a. fatigue > > This is essentially a measure of how much physical exertion > a given creature can accomplish. As the amount of fatigue > rises, the creature begins to lose vigor (Str) and can accomplish > less. In game terms, we assign a maximum number of "fatigue points" > (fp) that may be accumulated by each creature based on their Str + > (physique) experience level (in players) or just assign it to a > monster (just like hit points). > > The amount of Str lost depends on the percentage of fatigue > points relative to the maximum number of fp. For very high > levels of fatigue, our healing rate is effected adversely. > ... > Note, as you lose strength, you will auto-matically be slowed > down (from the speed calculation in fix_player) thus simulating > a characters "tiredness". > > Fatigue is regained at a rate equal to about 2x that of hit > points. In players this rate is based on their Str and Con > (in monsters the Str value is used). > > Most probably, it would be nice to have a stat bar in the lower > window for monitoring the current fatigue level. I would suggest a close connection between hp and fatigue. The "hp" are something silimiar anyway: If a character with 2 of 150 hp's left really would be damaged physically (i.e compltly mutiliated) I couldn't see how he could be healed again. I always pictured low hp characters as: exhausted and many scratches. Idee: "fatigue" is used up before the "hit points". If fatigue is low most attacks wouldn't atcually physically damage - they would use up stamina, though. After stamina is used up, hits would immediatly decrease hip points, as would arrows or backstabbing. > b. bleeding > > Bleeding refers to the damaging effect of blood loss from open > wounds. Not all weapons will cause bleeding nor will all creatures > bleed (ex the undead!, also see above). Maces probably don't cause bleeding but other nasty effects eg. breaking bones... > The rate of bleeding will vary from second to second depending on > the damage the creature has received and its healing rate. Should depend on a "healing" skill and the availability of bandages. > You can bleed to death. Experience is awarded to the owner of > the "wound" that did the killing damage. But that's a bit similiar to the wands (which don't award xp). Why reward the attacker just because the victim has no bandages? > III. Extended weapons. ... Great! Additional idea (actually something completly different): make a weapon subtype which I could refer to in maps. E.g (in a narrow passageway): "you can't use a poleaxe here!". > IV. Appendum - other related stuff ==== > > a. Armour & Weapon repair > > We can make an "anvil" in the shops that will repair armour to > its original (ie arch->clone.obj) properties. Magical equipment > can only be repaired by the enchant armour scrolls (but we > should probably drop the weight increase effect for using these > scrolls). We could drop the cost in these scrolls, or just > make magical properties restorable by the anvils. > > Weapons could have a repair anvil too, but here only the > original "magical" properties of the equipment are restored. Don't allow "magic repair". If the magic is lost, it's lost and can only be recreated. (Besides: the making of magic weapons/armour should require a magic weapon/armour SKILL.) > b. Changes to skills, new skills first_aid and 2-handed melee > > With the new attack modes, it makes sense to give some new > properties to older skills, ie: > > Jumping skill -- Give it ability to do knockback (really > ought to call this skill jumping/kicking). > Allow more damage versus inanimate objects > (eg. doors). > Punching skill -- Give it a stun effect as per bash. > Karate skill -- Allow it to parry thrown weapons/arrows. > Clawing skill -- Give it a cutting attack mode. > > And lets add two new skills: > > first aid -- Application can lower the bleeding level > and do *minor* healing (ie 1-2 pts). May > implement this as a skill-item "bandages" > (this is a knowledge skill either way). Good idea. Why not additionally add a "healer" skill which affects the long term healing rate? > 2-handed melee -- User can wield 2 weapons (with restrictions > based on Str). The primary weapon can be > used to make special attacks, and the > secondary weapon is used to determine the > effect of being able to 'parry' special > attacks (ie takes the place of a shield; > in parrying a special attack the secondary > weapon may be damaged too!). > You get some small ac and damage benefits > from the secondary weapon too. May get lower > exp gain from using this skill (for the > sake of playbalance). Hmmm, - even a low leven character should get more ac from a shield than a high level char from a secondary weapon - make it difficult to learn: 1.secondary weapon get's a ?20%? penalty (left hand) 2.starters need MORE time to attack with primary and secondary weapon than TWO times with a single handed attack. (Additional idea: a fighter should get higher WC when really SINGLE handed, ie no shield.) 3.high level characters need LESS time to attack with both weapons than TWO times single handed. FINALLY: how about: 1) skills for different weapon types. It would be great to have different weapon types (dagger, mace, sword, axe, staff, two-handed-weapon). A fighter would start with several, others only with "dagger". A character who has sword skill still can use swords - but he would miss often and couldn't do any special attacks. 2) beside 2-handed melee, healing and melee - other skills that could affect fighting: - fencing (higher chance for impale attacs, advantages against light weapons) - backstabbing (against neutral/friendly monsters); - special "monster lore" (undead, trolls, dragons, feline ... whatever) could give advanteges against corresponding monsters. - "hiding" could give attack advantages (or does it already?) 3) difficult to implement, but I thing useful: SKILL LEVELS. - AFAIK skills are "hidden objects" in the player's inventory; so, if there is a variable left it could be used for the "skill level"; - the "skill level" would raise with usage (0-100%), - for the time being, if the code doesn't make use of the skill level, no harm is done, - possible effects: a) low skill levels would cause dropped/damaged weapons, missed attacks, etc b) high skill levels would cause many special attacks, critical attacs, maybe even "fear"/"confusion"-type attacks. -- Florian ------------------------------------------------ | h729ihqu@sun1.cip.fak14.uni-muenchen.de | | http://www.fak14.uni-muenchen.de/~h729ihqu/ | ------------------------------------------------ From owner-crossfire Tue Sep 24 05:26:13 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Tue, 24 Sep 1996 05:26:13 +0200 Received: from mne.ifi.uio.no (1232@mne.ifi.uio.no [129.240.70.5]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Tue, 24 Sep 1996 05:26:10 +0200 Received: (from kjetilho@localhost) by mne.ifi.uio.no ; Tue, 24 Sep 1996 05:26:08 +0200 Message-Id: <199609240326.1678.mne.ifi.uio.no@ifi.uio.no> Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 16:15:15 -0700 (PDT) From: William Tanksley Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: CF: combat proposal (long) Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO On Sun, 22 Sep 1996, Ivan Avramovic wrote: > As for spicing up combat, I have a suggestion that doesn't involve actually > changing combat mechanics. I suggest that instead of using strings telling > you that you grazed, hit, or killed the enemy, use more dramatic strings like > "you bloodied the orc", "you pound the zombie into a pulp", etc. I hate being forced to look at those things, though-- they're nice, but once you find out that they mean absolutely nothing they're a real pain. I would enjoy a combat system that was fairly simple to use yet offered variety. The original suggestion was amusing enough, but I don't really think it's sufficient. For an example, look at Omega. In Omega, any physical attack (i.e. one delivered by weapon) is delivered over one of three attack lines: high, medium, or low. Blocking is also constrained to those levels. If a monster attacks high while you're blocking high you have a chance to block the blow. To change the way you attack and block, you use the F command, within which you get to arrange your attacks (of which you get a limited number, as permitted by your DEX) as follows: lunge high (2 attacks) riposte center (2 attacks) thrust center (1 attack) thrust low (1 attack) block high (1 attack) block low (1 attack) = 8 attacks. (Omega's maximum.) As you can see, certain moves use more of your attack points than others, but produce more interesting effects. A riposte provides the same blocking power as a block, but upon success allows you an ordinary attack down the same line with slightly improved chances. A lunge is more powerful than an attack and has a better chance of hitting. (Both ripostes and lunges only apply to certain types of weapons.) Now, certain monsters are limited in how they can attack you (or I should say that you can defend from several of their lines of attack in only one of your lines). As you play you'll notice that (say) an alligator always attacks low, and so when you go against an alligator you'll always reset your fighting options to ignore the upper lines (although you can still attack an alligator from any line). I think a system like this would do a lot for Crossfire. It would fit in well with the general system, and it could easily be made more automated-- for example, you could gain experience in a "Bladework" skill every time you learn about a new attack from a different monster (for instance, when your character first notices that alligators attack only in the low lines, and goblins attack only in low and center). The higher your bladework skill is, the more likely that any familiar attack would automatically be met with a rearrangement of your bladework. This could even take the place of normal experience bonuses for fighting! In addition, it allows for a Verbosity option, so people that like to see all the words can get full descriptions of the fight: The orc lunges low. You parry the plow, and attempt a riposte. The orc blocks the riposte. And so on. Mixed with the different attack types previously covered, this gives not only colorful descriptions but also a truly useful, fun, and logical experience system for fighters. > -Ivan -Billy From owner-crossfire Mon Sep 23 19:36:45 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 19:36:45 +0200 Received: from xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov [128.183.126.216]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 19:36:34 +0200 Received: (from thomas@localhost) by xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (LHEA9504/950407.s1) id NAA06525; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 13:36:20 -0400 Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 13:36:20 -0400 From: Brian Thomas Message-Id: <199609231736.NAA06525@xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: mergatroid@grumblesmurf.net Subject: Re: CF: map development? Cc: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO > From: Joakim Rastberg writes: > > I'm currently making the final touches on a new quest; About 15 maps with > the exiting twist of obeying all the rules in the mapguide (I want that > 9 rating!!! Although with the propogating_cone_spells-bug fixed they are > perhaps a bit too deadly (Lake_Country Snake Pit is a wimpy dungeon:-) > Sounds good to me, but one comment-- Ultra-high maps are nice, but what would be even better is more 1-10th level based quests. THe only good ones I know of are the smuggler's adventure in navar city, moogly bill's gold, and goblin isle (my favorite low-level map set). > When sufficiently playtested I will put them on ftp.ifi.uio.no in > /pub/crossfire/incoming as mirvs_tower.0926.tar-Z. > Be sure to announce this to the list! I dont regularly check the ftp sites for new stuff (its so rare anything new is there...) -b.t. > /Joakim (jor@solace.mh.se) > ------- > Civilazation as we know it will come to an end at Jan 19 03:14:07 GMT 2038. > > From owner-crossfire Mon Sep 23 19:31:26 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 19:31:26 +0200 Received: from xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov [128.183.126.216]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 19:31:21 +0200 Received: (from thomas@localhost) by xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (LHEA9504/950407.s1) id NAA06511; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 13:31:15 -0400 Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 13:31:15 -0400 From: Brian Thomas Message-Id: <199609231731.NAA06511@xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: peterm@csua.berkeley.edu Subject: Re: CF: map development? (light/darkness!) Cc: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Hi Peter! > From: Peter Mardahl writes: > > Has anyone been creating maps? I looked again > at the world and I haven't really seen very many > interesting new maps. I glanced briefly at > Brian Thomas' maps using the editor, but was > unable to determine whether they were actually linked in > or not. > Oh, I submitted the valley of the sisters quest to Mark..a glitch in the map connections should be cleared up in 0.92.7. As I informed Mark, my other (copious) maps are'nt really ready for prime-time. I seem to spend most of my time hacking on the server.... :) Some new maps (which I think are good) include Kundi's Lake_country, but even these (on the berkeley server) are about 1 yr old. Kundi does some interesting things with the map mechanics, which I highly recogmend taking a look at. > I don't have much of a feel for the game, so I don't > want to start making new maps yet. (f > er, feel for the game after the many changes over the last > year or so). > I would very much like to see more of your maps! One new thing which I think would add nice dimension to maps is the lighting code. I submitted some modified maps that use this (err... one of the sets was your dragon quest maps, please take a look at them! I didnt want any of the map authours to get upset by outside people playing with them...). it is fairly easy to add light-dark spaces to any map. It can improve the play of the map alot if done well. Anyway, nice to hear from you! Hope to see some more of your quality maps soon! -b.t. From owner-crossfire Mon Sep 23 16:19:58 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 16:19:58 +0200 Received: from maud.ifi.uio.no (0@maud.ifi.uio.no [129.240.74.2]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 16:19:54 +0200 Received: from xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov [128.183.126.216]) by maud.ifi.uio.no ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 16:19:51 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from thomas@localhost) by xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (LHEA9504/950407.s1) id KAA06306; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 10:18:35 -0400 Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 10:18:35 -0400 From: Brian Thomas Message-Id: <199609231418.KAA06306@xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no, timm@x.co.uk Subject: Re: CF: Throwing patch Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO > From: Tim Moss writes: > > I was just wondering if an entry is needed in skill_params > for throwing when the throwing patch is added? > Nope. The skill_params file is used for on-the-fly adjusting of skills parameters (like spell params). -bt. From owner-crossfire Mon Sep 23 16:15:41 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 16:15:41 +0200 Received: from xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov [128.183.126.216]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 16:15:37 +0200 Received: (from thomas@localhost) by xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (LHEA9504/950407.s1) id KAA06302; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 10:15:31 -0400 Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 10:15:31 -0400 From: Brian Thomas Message-Id: <199609231415.KAA06302@xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no, timm@x.co.uk Subject: CF: half-orc treasures.. Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Yeep. Sorry everyone. Here's the half-orc treasures entry: treasure pl_half_orc list fighter_skills more arch mace more arch round_shield more arch scale_mail more arch sack more arch skill_stealing end Insert it near the other player entries (its just above the halfling entry in my file). -b.t. From owner-crossfire Mon Sep 23 15:02:48 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 15:02:48 +0200 Received: from scol.sco.com (scol.london.sco.COM [150.126.1.48]) by ifi.uio.no with SMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 15:02:38 +0200 Received: from middx.x.co.uk by scol.london.sco.COM id aa01480; 23 Sep 96 12:33 GMT Received: from avon.x.co.uk by middx.sco.COM id aa07061; 23 Sep 96 13:33 BST Received: by avon.x.co.uk (8.6.8.2/1.2-eef) id MAA28424; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 12:30:34 GMT From: Tim Moss Message-Id: <199609231230.MAA28424@avon.x.co.uk> Subject: CF: New players types problem Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 12:30:33 +0000 (GMT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 421 Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO pl_half_orc is not in the standard treasures file as claimed and so an error is produced on crossfire startup Tim ____________________________________________________________________________ Tim Moss SCO Client Integration Division Phone: +44 (0)1223 518034 Software Engineer Vision Park Cambridge England Phax : +44 (0)1223 518001 WWW: http://www.vision.sco.com Email: timm@sco.com From owner-crossfire Mon Sep 23 22:53:47 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 22:53:47 +0200 Received: from doomsday.iam.uni-bonn.de (root@rhrz-ts2-p14.rhrz.uni-bonn.de [131.220.224.124]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 22:53:41 +0200 Received: (from tgm@localhost) by doomsday.iam.uni-bonn.de (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA00366; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 13:53:15 +0200 From: Thomas Ackermann Message-Id: <199609231153.NAA00366@doomsday.iam.uni-bonn.de> Subject: Re: CF: combat proposal (long) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: thomas@xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (Brian Thomas) Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 13:53:15 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: crossfire@ifi.uio.no In-Reply-To: <199609221232.IAA05714@xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov> from "Brian Thomas" at Sep 22, 96 08:32:08 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Brian Thomas wrote: > I have been putting together some ideas about the combat > system which I would like to share for critical discussion. > Some of this stuff I have already mentioned in earlier email, > so ardent readers of this list should recognize many of these > ideas. The framework which I am presenting below, is however, > very new. > > As always, changes should be implemented with the idea of > 'fun' first, realism second. > -b.t. I have had only a short look over your proposal (ever played GURPS? ;-) and cannot commend about the single ideas and effects, but the whole idea just hits me fully! CF was always *nice*, i though, but i never realy played it - *exactly* your idea could be something that enhanced CF to a more Roleplaying-like game. You do not bash some stats against each other until one or the other dies, but have the possibility to realy *act* within the game-world! I realy love it! Problem maybe beeing, that this kind of combat needs alot of more intelligence for the computer-creatures ... Otherwise, you could use tactics that are much too efficient against them. Thanx for your mail, and Byebye, -- Thomas (tgm) Ackermann | G i b GATES | DOS* |Great minds tja ;-) Tel. 0228/73-7773 | 631369 | k e i n e | WIN* |discuss ideas (e-mail: tgm@rhein.iam.uni-bonn.de) | C h a n c e ! | WIN95|-------------- -----------------------------------------------------------------|Average minds mail a sole "help" and/or "add discuss-l" line (in mail-body) to |discuss events listserv@math.uni-bonn.de to be added to a list were you can |-------------- talk about non-GURPS related things with people from GURPSnet-L |Small minds -----------------------------------------------------------------|discuss people From owner-crossfire Mon Sep 23 16:32:02 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 16:32:02 +0200 Received: from mne.ifi.uio.no (1232@mne.ifi.uio.no [129.240.70.5]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 16:31:58 +0200 Received: (from kjetilho@localhost) by mne.ifi.uio.no ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 16:31:56 +0200 Message-Id: <199609231431.207.mne.ifi.uio.no@ifi.uio.no> From: Thomas Ackermann Subject: Re: CF: combat proposal (long) Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 13:47:20 +0200 (MET DST) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Ivan Avramovic wrote: > So, you're looking to spice up combat, are you? To be honest, I didn't > read the proposal carefully, because I believe that in a case like this, > it's better to see whether it works in practice rather than what it looks > like on (virtual) paper. I'm all for seeing it tried, as long as you're > willing to scrap it if it turns out to be too cumbersome. > > As for spicing up combat, I have a suggestion that doesn't involve actually > changing combat mechanics. I suggest that instead of using strings telling > you that you grazed, hit, or killed the enemy, use more dramatic strings like > "you bloodied the orc", "you pound the zombie into a pulp", etc. > Have the game select a random string out of a database, based on the amount > of damage inflicted, the weapon/attack type, and type of monster. The > same applies to witty sound bytes. > I've seen this kind of strategy used before (in games like "Wasteland") and > I think it does make combat more interesting. It seems, you are happy with very few things - kind of minimalist ... What you propose it *no* change to the combat-system, but simply a little change in the environment - and to be honest, i believe, that such "dramatic strings" are over-read very fast ... Byebye, -- Thomas (tgm) Ackermann | G i b GATES | DOS* |Great minds tja ;-) Tel. 0228/73-7773 | 631369 | k e i n e | WIN* |discuss ideas (e-mail: tgm@rhein.iam.uni-bonn.de) | C h a n c e ! | WIN95|-------------- -----------------------------------------------------------------|Average minds mail a sole "help" and/or "add discuss-l" line (in mail-body) to |discuss events listserv@math.uni-bonn.de to be added to a list were you can |-------------- talk about non-GURPS related things with people from GURPSnet-L |Small minds -----------------------------------------------------------------|discuss people From owner-crossfire Mon Sep 23 13:24:37 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 13:24:37 +0200 Received: from scol.sco.com (scol.london.sco.COM [150.126.1.48]) by ifi.uio.no with SMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 13:24:33 +0200 Received: from middx.x.co.uk by scol.london.sco.COM id aa28513; 23 Sep 96 10:56 GMT Received: from avon.x.co.uk by middx.sco.COM id aa06306; 23 Sep 96 11:55 BST Received: by avon.x.co.uk (8.6.8.2/1.2-eef) id KAA26873; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 10:52:28 GMT From: Tim Moss Message-Id: <199609231052.KAA26873@avon.x.co.uk> Subject: CF: Throwing patch Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 10:52:27 +0000 (GMT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 587 Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO I was just wondering if an entry is needed in skill_params for throwing when the throwing patch is added? I noticed some errors at compile time on Solaris 2.5 if the ENABLE_CHECKSUM and SPELL_FAILURE_EFFECTS options are defined I will mail the patches as soon as I have them Tim ____________________________________________________________________________ Tim Moss SCO Client Integration Division Phone: +44 (0)1223 518034 Software Engineer Vision Park Cambridge England Phax : +44 (0)1223 518001 WWW: http://www.vision.sco.com Email: timm@sco.com From owner-crossfire Mon Sep 23 12:48:40 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 12:48:40 +0200 Received: from xinit.se (root@vampire.xinit.se [194.14.168.3]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 12:48:35 +0200 Received: from lich (lich.xinit.se [194.14.168.2]) by xinit.se (8.7.3/8.7.4) with SMTP id MAA13105; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 12:48:20 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 12:48:19 +0200 (MET DST) From: Joakim Rastberg X-Sender: jor@lich Reply-To: mergatroid@grumblesmurf.net Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Peter Mardahl cc: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: CF: map development? In-Reply-To: <199609230130.SAA21872@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO On Sun, 22 Sep 1996, Peter Mardahl wrote: > Has anyone been creating maps? I looked again > at the world and I haven't really seen very many > interesting new maps. I'm currently making the final touches on a new quest; About 15 maps with the exiting twist of obeying all the rules in the mapguide (I want that 9 rating!!! Although with the propogating_cone_spells-bug fixed they are perhaps a bit too deadly (Lake_Country Snake Pit is a wimpy dungeon:-) When sufficiently playtested I will put them on ftp.ifi.uio.no in /pub/crossfire/incoming as mirvs_tower.0926.tar-Z. /Joakim (jor@solace.mh.se) ------- Civilazation as we know it will come to an end at Jan 19 03:14:07 GMT 2038. From owner-crossfire Mon Sep 23 12:10:16 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 12:10:16 +0200 Received: from voimax.voima.jkl.fi (samuli@voimax.voima.jkl.fi [193.185.117.34]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 12:10:08 +0200 Received: (from samuli@localhost) by voimax.voima.jkl.fi (8.7.6/8.7.3) id NAA04723 for crossfire@ifi.uio.no; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 13:10:05 +0300 From: Samuli Tursas Message-Id: <199609231010.NAA04723@voimax.voima.jkl.fi> Subject: CF: CF patches at ifi.uio.no Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 13:10:05 +0300 (EET DST) Content-Type: text Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Please upload new crossfire patches to ifi.uio.no also, tabloid.astro.psu.edu is _very_ slow all the time. Thanks, Samuli From owner-crossfire Mon Sep 23 12:21:13 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 12:21:13 +0200 Received: from scol.sco.com (scol.london.sco.COM [150.126.1.48]) by ifi.uio.no with SMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 12:21:08 +0200 Received: from middx.x.co.uk by scol.london.sco.COM id aa27281; 23 Sep 96 10:04 GMT Received: from avon.x.co.uk by middx.sco.COM id aa05724; 23 Sep 96 11:03 BST Received: by avon.x.co.uk (8.6.8.2/1.2-eef) id KAA25737; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 10:00:53 GMT From: Tim Moss Message-Id: <199609231000.KAA25737@avon.x.co.uk> Subject: Re: CF: corrupt files Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Mark Wedel Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 10:00:53 +0000 (GMT) Cc: crossfire@ifi.uio.no In-Reply-To: <9609230153.ZM6376@stealth.eng.pyramid.com> from "Mark Wedel" at Sep 23, 96 01:53:53 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 849 Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO I think the problem here is that crossfire has been compiled with the ENABLE_CHECKSUMS and USE_CHECKSUMS options so that editing the player file causes a mismatch in the checksums and therefore the players cannot save again. What is needed is a utility for server administrators that recalculates the checksums for modified player files and puts the new values in the file. This utility could then be used by the administrator any time that they had modified the player files. Warning: should not be available to the players though! Tim ____________________________________________________________________________ Tim Moss SCO Client Integration Division Phone: +44 (0)1223 518034 Software Engineer Vision Park Cambridge England Phax : +44 (0)1223 518001 WWW: http://www.vision.sco.com Email: timm@sco.com From owner-crossfire Mon Sep 23 10:54:38 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 10:54:38 +0200 Received: from bertha.pyramid.com (bertha.pyramid.com [129.214.1.100]) by ifi.uio.no with SMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 10:54:34 +0200 Received: from stealth-news.pyramid.com by bertha.pyramid.com (5.67/OSx5.1a Pyramid-Internet-Gateway) id AA16401; Mon, 23 Sep 96 08:54:00 GMT Received: by stealth.eng.pyramid.com (8.6.12/Pyramid_Internal_Configuration) id BAA06378; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 01:53:54 -0700 From: "Mark Wedel" Message-Id: <9609230153.ZM6376@stealth.eng.pyramid.com> Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 01:53:53 -0700 In-Reply-To: Bob Tanner "CF: corrupt files" (Sep 22, 9:58pm) References: <199609230258.VAA28497@wizard.real-time.com> X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.0 06sep94) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Bob Tanner , crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: CF: corrupt files Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Edit the stats directly on the saved player file using vi. -- --Mark From owner-crossfire Mon Sep 23 05:03:26 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 05:03:26 +0200 Received: from warrior.real-time.com (root@warrior.real-time.com [206.10.252.1]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 05:03:23 +0200 Received: from wizard.real-time.com (tanner@wizard.real-time.com [206.10.252.7]) by warrior.real-time.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id WAA19240 for ; Sun, 22 Sep 1996 22:03:18 -0500 (CDT) From: Bob Tanner Received: by wizard.real-time.com (8.7.5) id VAA28497; Sun, 22 Sep 1996 21:58:52 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <199609230258.VAA28497@wizard.real-time.com> Subject: CF: corrupt files Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Date: Sun, 22 Sep 1996 21:58:52 -0500 (CDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 PGP3 *ALPHA*] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO I am not sure if I should post this here, but.. I have been hosting a CF server and its a very big hit for my clients. Problem. The server crashed we several people online and the players files are now corrupt. I at first I thought they forgot their password but the files look totally different then the the other players. Now I am trying to restore this player, but any time I alter their stats as DM they cannot save. Is there any way around this? -- email : tanner@real-time.com | www : http://www.real-time.com/~tanner phone : (612)943-8700 | fax : (612)943-8300 motto : I program, therefore I am | From owner-crossfire Mon Sep 23 03:29:31 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 03:29:31 +0200 Received: from soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.43.52]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 03:29:28 +0200 Received: (from peterm@localhost) by soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (8.6.12/8.6.12) id SAA21872 for crossfire@ifi.uio.no; Sun, 22 Sep 1996 18:30:20 -0700 Date: Sun, 22 Sep 1996 18:30:20 -0700 From: Peter Mardahl Message-Id: <199609230130.SAA21872@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: CF: map development? Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Has anyone been creating maps? I looked again at the world and I haven't really seen very many interesting new maps. I glanced briefly at Brian Thomas' maps using the editor, but was unable to determine whether they were actually linked in or not. The last time I looked was a year or so ago. I don't have much of a feel for the game, so I don't want to start making new maps yet. (f er, feel for the game after the many changes over the last year or so). PM From owner-crossfire Mon Sep 23 00:55:31 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 00:55:31 +0200 Received: from hh-tig.csh.uiuc.edu (iavramov@hh-tig.csh.uiuc.edu [128.174.165.214]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 00:55:27 +0200 Received: (from iavramov@localhost) by hh-tig.csh.uiuc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.9) id RAA03578; Sun, 22 Sep 1996 17:58:01 -0500 Message-Id: <199609222258.RAA03578@hh-tig.csh.uiuc.edu> Subject: Re: CF: combat proposal (long) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: thomas@xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (Brian Thomas) Date: Sun, 22 Sep 1996 17:58:01 -0500 (CDT) Cc: crossfire@ifi.uio.no In-Reply-To: <199609221232.IAA05714@xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov> from "Brian Thomas" at Sep 22, 96 08:32:08 am From: Ivan Avramovic X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1003 Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO So, you're looking to spice up combat, are you? To be honest, I didn't read the proposal carefully, because I believe that in a case like this, it's better to see whether it works in practice rather than what it looks like on (virtual) paper. I'm all for seeing it tried, as long as you're willing to scrap it if it turns out to be too cumbersome. As for spicing up combat, I have a suggestion that doesn't involve actually changing combat mechanics. I suggest that instead of using strings telling you that you grazed, hit, or killed the enemy, use more dramatic strings like "you bloodied the orc", "you pound the zombie into a pulp", etc. Have the game select a random string out of a database, based on the amount of damage inflicted, the weapon/attack type, and type of monster. The same applies to witty sound bytes. I've seen this kind of strategy used before (in games like "Wasteland") and I think it does make combat more interesting. Either way, happy CFing. -Ivan From owner-crossfire Mon Sep 23 00:38:30 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 00:38:30 +0200 Received: from bertha.pyramid.com (bertha.pyramid.com [129.214.1.100]) by ifi.uio.no with SMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Mon, 23 Sep 1996 00:38:27 +0200 Received: from stealth-news.pyramid.com by bertha.pyramid.com (5.67/OSx5.1a Pyramid-Internet-Gateway) id AA23536; Sun, 22 Sep 96 22:37:55 GMT Received: by stealth.eng.pyramid.com (8.6.12/Pyramid_Internal_Configuration) id PAA29176; Sun, 22 Sep 1996 15:37:47 -0700 From: "Mark Wedel" Message-Id: <9609221537.ZM29174@stealth.eng.pyramid.com> Date: Sun, 22 Sep 1996 15:37:46 -0700 In-Reply-To: Brian Thomas "CF: combat proposal (long)" (Sep 22, 8:32am) References: <199609221232.IAA05714@xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov> X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.0 06sep94) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Brian Thomas , crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: CF: combat proposal (long) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO A few quick notes/questions: IF you just do normal attacks, will you be hit by fatigue, or is it only normal attacks? For weapon/armor damage, I would suggest using saving throw tables/code. After all, a wood club going against metal armor is much more likely to be damaged than a metal sword. Likewise, leather is more likely to be cut apart than full plate. The fact that the only way to fully repair magical armor is via the scrolls more or less means magic armor isn't really repaired (just recreated). This would seem to weaken the fighters viability some (or usefulness of items - what good is a +1 shield if it is going to be destroyed in the next battle?) But I guess that would depend on how often monsters use the special attacks. I would suggest that Con be factored in along with physique experience for fatigue calculations. AFter all, a starting character with a 20 con should be able to do a lot more than a starting character with a 10 con. Exact balance on this is open to debate. I would also suggest that Dex be factored into ability to use 2 weapons. A character with a 10 dex is probably worse off, just because he doesn't have coordination. Also, probably wouldn't be a bad idea to add a 2-handed weapon skill that you need. -- --Mark From owner-crossfire Sun Sep 22 14:32:18 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Sun, 22 Sep 1996 14:32:18 +0200 Received: from xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov [128.183.126.216]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Sun, 22 Sep 1996 14:32:11 +0200 Received: (from thomas@localhost) by xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (LHEA9504/950407.s1) id IAA05714 for crossfire@ifi.uio.no; Sun, 22 Sep 1996 08:32:08 -0400 Date: Sun, 22 Sep 1996 08:32:08 -0400 From: Brian Thomas Message-Id: <199609221232.IAA05714@xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: CF: combat proposal (long) Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Hi all, I have been putting together some ideas about the combat system which I would like to share for critical discussion. Some of this stuff I have already mentioned in earlier email, so ardent readers of this list should recognize many of these ideas. The framework which I am presenting below, is however, very new. As always, changes should be implemented with the idea of 'fun' first, realism second. -b.t. OUTLINE >>> ----------- 0. Proposal overview I. Weapon attack modes a. damage to armour/weapons b. how to 'invoke' special attacks c. immunities. II. Fatigue and Bleeding. III. Extended weapons. IV. Appendum - other related stuff a. Armour & Weapon repair b. Changes to skills, 2 new skills. c. Changes to spells and new spell ideas 0. Proposal overview These changes are motivated by the rather 1-dimensional quality of fighter combat in CF. Basically, you run into a monster to hit it then you stand there as long as possible hitting it until either you or the monster is dead. In contrast, things are a bit more exciting when either you or the monster is throwing spells. Also, spellcasters (by the nature of many, many spells) have many more 'options' for tackling 'problems'. What to do?? Is it possible to 'jazz' up the fighter and his options? Hopefully! In this proposal, I suggest ways to modify the combat system so that new abilities and restrictions on combat come into being. In general, things wont change alot, if you run into a monster with a wielded weapon, you will make an attack *exactly* the same as you do now, if you are hit by a monster, you take damage, etc.. Basically, changes revolve about 3 main things which can be used by both players and monsters: new weapon attack modes (occur when weapons are used in a 'special' way) and their effects, the use of fatigue and bleeding, and a new 'special' extended attack. I. Weapon attack modes When a creature (player or monster) makes a 'special' attack, the code will examine the weapon (or hth skill) for special attack mode flags. If any are found, then a successful attack is modified (mostly in terms of the damage caused). Here are some ideas for attack modes ("fat cost"== fatigue cost for each use of that attack, see below on fatigue): Table 1. Attack modes Attack Mode Fat Cost Effect ----------- -------- ---------------------------- impale low - none 1-Double all damage that penetrates armour. Weapon may become stuck with chance based on the total damage inflicted. cut low 1-Attacks cause bleeding to occur and Mult all damage that penetrates armour by 1 1/3. bash moderate 1-Attacks can damage armour (worn and intrinsic, see below). 2-Can stun some opponents (esp those smaller critters w/o helmets!). 3-Can cause 'knockback'-- makes victim move back 1-2 squares. chop moderate 1-Attacks can damage armour (as above). 2-Mult. all dam that penetrates armour by 1 1/2 and can cause bleeding to occur. disarm low 1-may disarm the victim. dig high 1-used to dig a pit, can't effect living creatures. Some Notes: a. damage to armour/weapons When you make a special attack we need to examine the attacking weapon and the armour being attacked. Choice of armour item will be in order 1) worn shield, or 2) the top armour item in the inventory (that is worn). For most special attacks, REGARDLESS of the SUCCESS of the attack, IF the armour item is immune|protected to ALL of the weapons attacktypes OR the magic of the armour =< magic of weapon then we may damage the weapon. Next, for all successful attacks, we determine the effect based on the attack mode and item properties: Impale -- If armour exists, item may become stuck with a chance equal to the total damage inflicted. If the weapon is being wielded (ie, its a spear, not an arrow shot from a bow) then we make ONE test immediately to see if the weapon may be withdrawn (based on wielder str, level and the armour rating). Successful withdrawal has a small chance of damaging the weapon IF the magic of the armour is higher than the weapon magic. Cut -- Nothing beyond initial damage check. Bash -- Damages armour with magic value =< weapon magic. Chance of damaging armour is equal to total damage. If damage occurs then ac value of the armour is reduced by 1 and the armour value is decreased by random value of the damage that was *stopped* by the armour (ie total damage times the armour percentage). Reduction in the armour value can not exceed the wielders strength (damage) bonus (ie, a Str 20 warrior can't do more than a 3 pt reduction in the armour value). Chop -- Damages armour as Bash. Disarm -- NO initial damage check. Dig -- NO initial damage check. If a weapon/armour item accumulates a negative ac/wc "bonus" greater than its magic bonus, it is destroyed. This means that an ordinary small shield (ac 1) is destroyed after accumulating 2 damaging hits (ac first goes to "0", on next hit it then becomes negative) and a +1 small shield can take 3 hits. A piece of armour is also destroyed if its armour value drops below 0. Armour and weapons may be repaired (see below). b. how to 'invoke' special attacks Under some attack modes several effects are listed. For a first pass at coding this, each effect listed is checked for in every attack. Later, we may think of an easy, intuitive way to allow the wielder to select the special attack effect. The player invokes a special attack by readying the melee weapons skill, and making a 'ranged' attack. Monsters may make special attacks based on their intelligence, attack movement, and whether they have the skill_melee_weapons in their inventory. c. immunities. Of course, some monsters will be immune to some or all of these attack modes, and may be unaffected by bleeding and fatigue. For players, some magical items may make the user immune to some attack modes and reduce or (in rare and REALLY powerful items) eliminate the effects of fatigue and/or bleeding. Some player character types may not be affected by bleeding (cf. fireborn and wraith). II. Fatigue and Bleeding. Probably, we can implement these each as invisible (applied) archs in the player (or monster) inventory (eg similar to the way 'paralyze', 'confusion' and 'slow' are implemented). Other than that, these are quite different. Lets explore each separately: a. fatigue This is essentially a measure of how much physical exertion a given creature can accomplish. As the amount of fatigue rises, the creature begins to lose vigor (Str) and can accomplish less. In game terms, we assign a maximum number of "fatigue points" (fp) that may be accumulated by each creature based on their Str + (physique) experience level (in players) or just assign it to a monster (just like hit points). The amount of Str lost depends on the percentage of fatigue points relative to the maximum number of fp. For very high levels of fatigue, our healing rate is effected adversely. Table 2. Effect of accumulated Fatigue: current fp/max fp Str loss Healing rate 0 - 0.3 none no effect 0.3 - 0.4 10% no effect 0.4 - 0.5 20% no effect 0.5 - 0.7 35% slowed slightly (Con-1) 0.8 - 0.9 50% slowed (Con-3) 0.9 - 1.0 80% slowed highly (Con-5) Note, as you lose strength, you will auto-matically be slowed down (from the speed calculation in fix_player) thus simulating a characters "tiredness". Fatigue is regained at a rate equal to about 2x that of hit points. In players this rate is based on their Str and Con (in monsters the Str value is used). Most probably, it would be nice to have a stat bar in the lower window for monitoring the current fatigue level. b. bleeding Bleeding refers to the damaging effect of blood loss from open wounds. Not all weapons will cause bleeding nor will all creatures bleed (ex the undead!, also see above). The rate of bleeding will vary from second to second depending on the damage the creature has received and its healing rate. From a cutting or chopping attack you receive 1 'level' of bleeding for every 10 points of damage from that attack (and a new bleeding arch is put into your inventory). Bleeding damage would appear similar to a poison attack, ie you take damage for every time interval, with the interval being smaller as bleeding level is increased. Bleeding slows down as time passes (and amount it slows is dependent on Con rating). You can bleed to death. Experience is awarded to the owner of the "wound" that did the killing damage. III. Extended weapons. Some weapons will allow "extended" attacks into squares not adjacent to the wielder. When an extended weapon is wielded, an image of it appears in the square that the wielder faces (if a wall was there to begin with, you CANT wield the weapon!). Examples of extended weapons include "long spear" and "pole-axe". The mechanics of combat and movement for the weapon wielder would be changed. Consider this picture of an attack w/ extended weapon: ------- ------- ------- | 0 | | 9 | | |/ | ----> | (|} | | | | | | | | / \ | | / \ | ------- ------- ------- ^ ^ ^ | | | wielder ext.wpn victim In the above diagram, an extended weapon wielder attacks a victim. Because the "victim" is not adjacent to the wielder, it CAN'T attack the wielder of the weapon. The wielder of the weapon IS able to damage the victim. Were the victim to move 1 square NORTH or SOUTH no extended attack could occur. If the victim moved 1 square to the SOUTH-WEST or NORTH-WEST (ie adjacent to the wielder) it could attack the wielder. Note that the victim (in the position above) could use a special attack that damages armour (like "chop") to damage the extended weapon. It is not possible to use the "disarm" maneuver vs. extended weapon UNLESS you are adjacent to the wielder. When a extended weapon is wielded, the movement of the wielder changes as follows: - you will advance squares only in the facing and anti-facing directions (ie either move forward or backward). - if you give a command to move in another direction, the code will TURN you 1 square as if you were pulled that way (ie you just change your facing, but don't move forward). For example, if the wielder in the above diagram issued the command "north" his weapon (and he!) would point to the north-east. Another "north" command would point the weapon to the north. Yet another "north" command would advance the weapon and the wielder forward by 1 square. IV. Appendum - other related stuff ==== a. Armour & Weapon repair We can make an "anvil" in the shops that will repair armour to its original (ie arch->clone.obj) properties. Magical equipment can only be repaired by the enchant armour scrolls (but we should probably drop the weight increase effect for using these scrolls). We could drop the cost in these scrolls, or just make magical properties restorable by the anvils. Weapons could have a repair anvil too, but here only the original "magical" properties of the equipment are restored. b. Changes to skills, new skills first_aid and 2-handed melee With the new attack modes, it makes sense to give some new properties to older skills, ie: Jumping skill -- Give it ability to do knockback (really ought to call this skill jumping/kicking). Allow more damage versus inanimate objects (eg. doors). Punching skill -- Give it a stun effect as per bash. Karate skill -- Allow it to parry thrown weapons/arrows. Clawing skill -- Give it a cutting attack mode. And lets add two new skills: first aid -- Application can lower the bleeding level and do *minor* healing (ie 1-2 pts). May implement this as a skill-item "bandages" (this is a knowledge skill either way). 2-handed melee -- User can wield 2 weapons (with restrictions based on Str). The primary weapon can be used to make special attacks, and the secondary weapon is used to determine the effect of being able to 'parry' special attacks (ie takes the place of a shield; in parrying a special attack the secondary weapon may be damaged too!). You get some small ac and damage benefits from the secondary weapon too. May get lower exp gain from using this skill (for the sake of playbalance). c. Changes to spells and new spells It would be nice to create some clerical spells can that affect attack modes, bleeding and fatigue. Alter the healing spells so that fatigue and bleeding can also be 'cured'. Wizard spells could be created that allow the player to temporarily enchant their weapons with special attack modes. From owner-crossfire Sat Sep 21 18:00:50 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Sat, 21 Sep 1996 18:00:50 +0200 Received: from sigma.sm.luth.se (root@sigma.sm.luth.se [130.240.2.1]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Sat, 21 Sep 1996 18:00:48 +0200 Received: from bobe.campus.luth.se (ef.dd@bobe.campus.luth.se [130.240.192.165]) by sigma.sm.luth.se (8.7.2/8.7.2) with SMTP id SAA19520 for ; Sat, 21 Sep 1996 18:00:44 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <324410ED.5641@sm.luth.se> Date: Sat, 21 Sep 1996 17:59:42 +0200 From: Thorbjorn X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: CF: Crossfire servers Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Hello!! I wonder if it exist some crossfire servers in Europe now. The serverlist is quite outdated and i havn't found any information about it. Please mail to me or to the maillist if you know some. Best Regards Thorbjorn ,Sweden From owner-crossfire Sat Sep 21 13:19:03 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Sat, 21 Sep 1996 13:19:03 +0200 Received: from xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov [128.183.126.216]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Sat, 21 Sep 1996 13:18:59 +0200 Received: (from thomas@localhost) by xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (LHEA9504/950407.s1) id HAA05311; Sat, 21 Sep 1996 07:18:57 -0400 Date: Sat, 21 Sep 1996 07:18:57 -0400 From: Brian Thomas Message-Id: <199609211118.HAA05311@xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no, mwedel@pyramid.com Subject: Re: CF: Major bug find (lighting patch, altered maps) Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO > From: "Mark Wedel" writes: > > I found the bug that was causing cones to have zero length. This should > also fix the bug of experience not being credited after a while. > Congrats! That was a pretty hard one to catch...I bow in respect. :) Could I have a patch for that bug? And now on to my mail I was in the process of composing... This past evening I have put together a patch for the lighting code. It encompasses 3 parts: - code patch to fix a bug for torches (is_changing obj) and to cut down on lighting code chatter from the server. - modified archs for the undead. Many of them could not see in the dark! For those undead w/o see_invisible, I added can_see_in_dark. - And the big change---- I added light/darkness to several series of maps. I tried to avoid doing anything else in respect to the orignial map authors wishes, however, in In one case I had to modify some of the monster archs so that the creatures could see in the dark. Also, there are some additional modifications to the thomas/sisters maps (which don't pertain to the lighting code, but hey, I wrote them! so I feel allowed..) You can find the light_2.tar.gz file in pub/thomas on ftp.astro.psu.edu. Comments on the maps changes (good/bad) are strongly invited...so stop reading this message and start ftp'ing! :) -b.t. From owner-crossfire Sat Sep 21 12:45:45 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Sat, 21 Sep 1996 12:45:45 +0200 Received: from bertha.pyramid.com (bertha.pyramid.com [129.214.1.100]) by ifi.uio.no with SMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Sat, 21 Sep 1996 12:45:41 +0200 Received: from stealth-news.pyramid.com by bertha.pyramid.com (5.67/OSx5.1a Pyramid-Internet-Gateway) id AA27157; Sat, 21 Sep 96 10:45:08 GMT Received: by stealth.eng.pyramid.com (8.6.12/Pyramid_Internal_Configuration) id DAA26486; Sat, 21 Sep 1996 03:44:55 -0700 From: "Mark Wedel" Message-Id: <9609210344.ZM26484@stealth.eng.pyramid.com> Date: Sat, 21 Sep 1996 03:44:54 -0700 X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.0 06sep94) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: CF: Major bug find. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO I found the bug that was causing cones to have zero length. This should also fix the bug of experience not being credited after a while. The basic problem was teh the 'count' element in the object structure was turned into a uint32 a while back, but the ownercount remained an unsigned short. So until the 2^16's objects were created, everything worked fine. But after that, these values would no longer match up, so the owner could not be found - thus no experience, and no propogating cone spells. This is just a heads up so those of you hunting for this bug can stop. --Mark -- --Mark From owner-crossfire Fri Sep 20 15:01:42 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Fri, 20 Sep 1996 15:01:42 +0200 Received: from mne.ifi.uio.no (1232@mne.ifi.uio.no [129.240.70.5]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Fri, 20 Sep 1996 15:01:38 +0200 Received: (from kjetilho@localhost) by mne.ifi.uio.no ; Fri, 20 Sep 1996 15:01:36 +0200 Message-Id: <199609201301.27349.mne.ifi.uio.no@ifi.uio.no> Mime-Version: 1.0 From: "Harald Fielker" Subject: CF: Crossfire -> Shadowfire To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Date: Fri, 20 Sep 1996 12:14:31 +0200 (MET DST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO [Harald is not on the crossfire mailing list -- Kjetil T.] Hi Shadowrun Fans, ( thanks to Thomas `Cyber` Reinhart for the e-mail list)=20 ---------------------\/\/\/\/\/------------------------ DAS GLEICHE IN DEUTSCH ---------------------\/\/\/\/\/------------------------ my name is Harald Fielker and I am a 21 years old German. My hobbies are computers and Shadowrun. For my new project I N E E D Y O U R H E L P !!! - - - - I'd like to write a Shadowrun type game on the PC. The main idea is to have a server module which is running on a UNIX environment and serveral client (DOS, WIN, ...) which can connect via TCP/IP to the server. The server should be connected to the internet and people all over the world can join the game and play. Hopefully you know the UNIX game Crossfire. Crossfire is a role playing game. You play a character in a Middle Age Fantasy world. The game supports multiplayer over the=20 internet. What is best, the software is under the GNU, that means we can take the code for free. Crossfire also contains some tools for buliding a "world". There is a object editor, a map creator and a tool to give the objects some "live". =20 The problem is, the tiles (graphics) are fantasy type, e.g. swords, axes, ... BUT I WANT SOME GRENADES, HMGs and CARs :-))) So we need some people who can make some new graphics. Crossfire also supports sounds. Maybe MOD/MIDI files (which should fit to the game setting) would me good. So we need some people who can compose music and sample some noise. If the editor is finished, some people should bulid the worlds and create RUNs. Now for my part: I'd like to coordinate the whole project. I also like coding (Crossfire is in C). Help is alway welcome! I will do the whole development in LINUX on a PENTIUM PC. Coming soon: Mailing list subscribe shadowfire@inga.augusta.de (this service will only start at 1.10.1996) Btw. SHADOWFIRE is the "official" name for this project because of copyright reasons with FASA. =20 So is you want to help, please send me a mail. We can meet on irc (irc.leo.org) on channel #shadowfire on saturday 21 September 1996 (14 MET). NICK ICEH=20 Bye, Harald ---------------------------------------------------------- so, jetzt in Deutsch :-) ---------------------------------------------------------- mein Name ist Harald Fielker. Ich bin 21 und meine Hobbies sind Computer und Shadowrun. F=FCr mein neues Projekt BRAUCHE ICH D E I N E H I L F E !!! - - - - - Ich will eine Shadowrun Computerspiel f=FCr den PC schreiben. Die Idee ist ein Servermodul, welche unter UNIX l=E4uft und Clients dazu (DOS, WIN, ...), die =FCber TCP/IP an den Server connecten. Der Server sollte einen Anschlu=DF ans INTERNET haben, so da=DF Leute aus aller Welt an dem Spiel teilnehmen k=F6nnen. Vielleicht kennst Du das UNIX Spiel Crossfire. Crossfire ist ein Rollenspiel. Man spielt einen Charakter in einer mittelalterlichen Fantasywelt. Das Spiel unterst=FCtzt Multiplayer =FCber das Internet. Was das Beste daran ist, der Code von Crossfire untersteht der GNU, das hei=DFt: der Code ist komplett frei. Crossfire enth=E4lt eine Menge Tools um eine "Welt" zu erschaffen. Es gibt einen Objekteditor, einen Karteneditor und Tools um Objekten "leben" zu geben. Das Problem daran ist, da=DF die Graphiken f=FCr eine Fantasy Welt ausgelegt sind. z.B. Schwerter, =C4xte=20 ABER I WILL GRANATEN, HMGs UND schnelle AUTOS :-) Deshalb br=E4uchten wir jemanden der neue Graphiken erstellen kann. Crossfire unterst=FCtzt auch Sound. MOD/MIDI Dateien zum Spiel passend w=E4ren vielleicht nicht schlecht. Deshalb br=E4uchten wir jemanden der Musik komponieren kann und einige Samples digitalisieren k=F6nnte. Wenn der Editor fertiggestellt ist, sollte jemand einige=20 "Welten" erschaffen und sich ein paar RUNs =FCberlegen. Nun zu meiner Aufgabe: Ich m=F6chte das ganze Projekt koordinieren. Ich programmiere haupts=E4chlich (Crossfire ist in C). Hilfe ist immer w=FCnschenswert! Ich entwickle das Ding unter Linux auf meinem PENTIDUM PC. MAILING LIST subscribe shadowfire@inga.augusta.de (ab 1.10.1996) =DCbrigens: SHADOWFIRE ist der "offizielle" Name f=FCr das Projekt, da ich =C4rger mit FASA vermeiden will :-) Wenn Du also helfen willst, schreibe mir eine Mail Am Samstag (21 September 1996) bin ich im irc (irc.leo.org) channel #shadowfire (ab 14.00 MET) NICK ICEH Bye, Harald From owner-crossfire Fri Sep 20 10:38:52 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Fri, 20 Sep 1996 10:38:52 +0200 Received: from nexus.astro.psu.edu (nexus.astro.psu.edu [128.118.147.20]) by ifi.uio.no with SMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Fri, 20 Sep 1996 10:38:42 +0200 Received: from zaphod.astro.psu.edu by nexus.astro.psu.edu (4.1/Nexus-1.3) id AA04037; Fri, 20 Sep 96 04:39:29 EDT Received: by zaphod.astro.psu.edu (4.1/Client-1.3) id AA20115; Fri, 20 Sep 96 04:38:32 EDT Date: Fri, 20 Sep 96 04:38:32 EDT From: "Brian Thomas" Message-Id: <9609200838.AA20115@zaphod.astro.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: CF: new player characters.. Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Hi, I have prepared a patch for 2 new player characters Ive been play-testing for sometime -- "halfling" and "half-orc". Both are 'thiefly' characters--with the half orc being more of a fighter-thief (magsman). The patch is in the file char.tar.gz and can be found on ftp.astro.psu.edu in pub/thomas. There are instructions for installing this "code", but it is sparse. If you have installed the throwing code (or any archs) then you should be able to figure it out. -b.t. From owner-crossfire Fri Sep 20 07:06:32 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Fri, 20 Sep 1996 07:06:32 +0200 Received: from xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov [128.183.126.216]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id ; Fri, 20 Sep 1996 07:06:28 +0200 Received: (from thomas@localhost) by xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (LHEA9504/950407.s1) id BAA04737; Fri, 20 Sep 1996 01:06:23 -0400 Date: Fri, 20 Sep 1996 01:06:23 -0400 From: Brian Thomas Message-Id: <199609200506.BAA04737@xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: kjetilho@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: CF: throwing skill patch Cc: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO > From: Kjetil Torgrim Homme > > Cool! Does poisonous booze take effect? > Well, yes, but the effect is the *same* as for players. ie, food value is lowered. Of course, this doesnt do anything to monsters. So I guess the real answer is 'no'. It wouldnt be hard to hack this into the apply code though. -b.t. > > Kjetil T. > From owner-crossfire Thu Sep 19 18:23:22 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Thu, 19 Sep 1996 18:23:22 +0200 Received: from hermes.hrz.uni-bielefeld.de (hermes.hrz.uni-bielefeld.de [129.70.4.55]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Thu, 19 Sep 1996 18:23:17 +0200 Received: from pppasc11.hrz.uni-bielefeld.de by hermes.hrz.uni-bielefeld.de with SMTP (1.37.109.17/16.2) id AA060990568; Thu, 19 Sep 1996 18:29:28 +0200 Message-Id: <199609191629.AA060990568@hermes.hrz.uni-bielefeld.de> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Stephan Graefe" Organization: Uni-Bielefeld.DE Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Date: Thu, 19 Sep 1996 18:21:56 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Subject: CF: unscribe Reply-To: Stephan.Graefe@HRZ.Uni-Bielefeld.DE Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.42a) Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO unscribe please unscribe me from your mailing-list. yours stephan graefe my email: sgraefe@hrz.uni-bielefeld.de Stephan Graefe Ringstrasse 61 32130 Enger Germany Tel.: +(0)5224/3478 Fax.: +(0)5224/3478 E-Mail: Stephan.Graefe@Post.Uni-Bielefeld.DE From owner-crossfire Fri Sep 20 00:55:25 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Fri, 20 Sep 1996 00:55:25 +0200 Received: from ecnet.ec (ecnet.ec [157.100.45.2]) by ifi.uio.no with SMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Fri, 20 Sep 1996 00:55:15 +0200 Received: from dial1.q.ecua.net.ec by ecnet.ec (AIX 3.2/UCB 5.64/4.04) id AA40071; Thu, 19 Sep 1996 17:53:29 -0500 Message-Id: <9609192253.AA40071@ecnet.ec> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Guillermo Bixby Ordonez" Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Date: Thu, 19 Sep 1996 17:51:03 +0000 Subject: Re: CF: unscribe Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.22) Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO From: GBO@PI.PRO.EC To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Date: Thu, 19 Sep 1996 16:51:56 Subject: CF: unscribe Reply-to: GBO@PI.PRO.EC Priority: normal unscribe please unscribe me from your mailing-list. yours GBO my email: GBO@PI.PRO.EC From owner-crossfire Thu Sep 19 15:17:41 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Thu, 19 Sep 1996 15:17:41 +0200 Received: from xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov [128.183.126.216]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Thu, 19 Sep 1996 15:17:35 +0200 Received: (from thomas@localhost) by xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (LHEA9504/950407.s1) id JAA04304; Thu, 19 Sep 1996 09:17:15 -0400 Date: Thu, 19 Sep 1996 09:17:15 -0400 From: Brian Thomas Message-Id: <199609191317.JAA04304@xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no, thomas@astro.psu.edu Subject: Re: CF: throwing skill patch Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO This is just a followup on the last message-- All older characters will *not* have the skill_throwing arch, and therefore will not be able to throw until it is edited in their player file. I was going to make a script to do this, but it seemed too trivial for the effort. So heres all you have to do, add the following lines in your player file: arch skill_throwing end Thats it. Make you dont edit it into a bag or something (!). The best bet is to locate the other player skills and add it right after one of them. Newly generated characters will now start with the throwing skill (its a basic skill all players receive). Thats all, b.t. From owner-crossfire Thu Sep 19 14:28:26 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Thu, 19 Sep 1996 14:28:26 +0200 Received: from nexus.astro.psu.edu (nexus.astro.psu.edu [128.118.147.20]) by ifi.uio.no with SMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Thu, 19 Sep 1996 14:28:20 +0200 Received: from zaphod.astro.psu.edu by nexus.astro.psu.edu (4.1/Nexus-1.3) id AA27405; Thu, 19 Sep 96 07:27:40 EDT Received: by zaphod.astro.psu.edu (4.1/Client-1.3) id AA15522; Thu, 19 Sep 96 07:26:44 EDT Date: Thu, 19 Sep 96 07:26:44 EDT From: "Brian Thomas" Message-Id: <9609191126.AA15522@zaphod.astro.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: CF: throwing skill patch Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Hi all, I have managed to put together a patch for a new skill-- throwing. This skill is used both by players and monsters. With it implemented, you will now see pirates throwing daggers at you, giants will hurl boulders. ALso, there is several special provsions made in the code ONE of which is code allowing for casting potions at creatures. IF you hit it with a potion, the potion takes effect (now there's a use for those potions of fiery destruction :). You can find the tarfile for this patch on ftp.astro.psu.edu in /pub/thomas (hte file is called throw.tar.gz). Enjoy, -b.t. note to mark: The "rock thrower" archs should be removed, as they are now useless. From owner-crossfire Wed Sep 18 17:43:53 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Wed, 18 Sep 1996 17:43:53 +0200 Received: from moe.fcol.com (jlarge@ns1.fcol.com [204.215.247.3]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Wed, 18 Sep 1996 17:43:47 +0200 Received: (from jlarge@localhost) by moe.fcol.com (8.7/8.6.12) id KAA18150; Wed, 18 Sep 1996 10:44:27 -0400 Date: Wed, 18 Sep 1996 10:44:27 -0400 (EDT) From: Jason Largen Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Brian Thomas cc: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: party system (was: CF: colors 2) In-Reply-To: <199609150520.BAA01206@xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Well I looked into it, just thru play testing, not going thru the code. And I had no problem with it sending the xp to the proper skill. Whatever skill one of the mages in my group had active is what they got, while my physque (spelling?) went up from melee weapons. Kinda on vacation until next weds, but some of the things we are changing to it changing party who to show hp, sp, and gr. Making the party split be based on number of players AND each of thiers level. (keeps it from being patheticaly easy for a higher level character to get a first level character up in levels). Thanks for the cool game. Jason Largen System Administrator First Coast Online (904)633-9888 (904)247-2067 pgr. jlarge@fcol.com On Sun, 15 Sep 1996, Brian Thomas wrote: > >> From: Jason Largen writes: > > > > Would anyone be interested in an upgraded party system? We are working on it (we all > > used to play a lot of muds so making it alot more mudlike) making some simple changes, so that > > it splits based on level, displays hps and sps and grace on the party who (might make it > > party status once it works right). Anyways just curious. > > > > Sure! One thing you might want to also look into-- I believe that > the current party system doesnt hand out experience to the right > exp objects. In other words, if you have a spell readied (current > skill: wizardry, current experience:magic) and your buddy kills > a monster wi his sword (current skill: melee weapons, current > experience: physique) you will get experience added to your "magic" > category, *not* physique! > > Every player has the same number of experience objects (always) so > this isnt an intractible problem. Probalby a name search of the other > party members inventory for the right experience object to add > experience to should work. > > -b.t. > > > Jason > > > > From owner-crossfire Wed Sep 18 08:30:31 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Wed, 18 Sep 1996 08:30:31 +0200 Received: from soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.43.52]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Wed, 18 Sep 1996 08:30:27 +0200 Received: (from peterm@localhost) by soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (8.6.12/8.6.12) id XAA29496 for crossfire@ifi.uio.no; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 23:31:22 -0700 Date: Tue, 17 Sep 1996 23:31:22 -0700 From: Peter Mardahl Message-Id: <199609180631.XAA29496@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: CF: the creator object, i don't think i ever documented it. Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Hello all, Some things Kundi mentioned reminded me of the 'creator' object which I had coded up long ago. What a creator is, is an object which creates another object when it is triggered. The daughter object can be anything. (yet another way other than runes to create surprise monsters, though runes are better for that, they're smarter at placing monsters) You've seen a creator demonstrated if you've solved the Tower of Demonology: when you summon a demon you also get some firetrails. It made for a nice effect, i thought. Anyway, could someone please add this to the documentation: Creator object: an object which creates other objects. It is usually invisible. connected: what will trigger it hp: how many times it may create before stopping lifesave: if set, it'll never disappear but will go on creating everytime it's triggered other_arch: the object to create ------------------------------------------------------ As a project someone might want to have the created object inherit any modifications the mapmaker makes to the creator object: for example, St 2 would be passed onto any object created by the creator, perhaps a sword or a crown. The code is in time.c, "move_creator" Regards, PeterM (crossfire programmer emeritus) From owner-crossfire Wed Sep 18 07:00:49 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Wed, 18 Sep 1996 07:00:49 +0200 Received: from soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.43.52]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Wed, 18 Sep 1996 07:00:46 +0200 Received: (from xkd@localhost) by soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA24004 for crossfire@ifi.uio.no; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 22:01:40 -0700 From: Kundi Xue Message-Id: <199609180501.WAA24004@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU> Subject: CF: Bug in that damned Kundi's map Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no (Mailist Crossfire) Date: Tue, 17 Sep 1996 22:01:38 -0700 (PDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 937 Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO John R. Murray wrote: > > I wrote: > >I tried to complete the Crown of Might quest from Lake Country... > > Hmm.. I tried it again with a freshly-loaded game and it worked. I've got > a sneaking suspicion... if I can get the game to go into funky-breath-spells > mode again anytime soon, I'm going to try this mechanism again... Yeah, buggy map. SOrry. The reason it failed is that, the game automatically put anything that's not alive under the pentagram, when the game save it to temp file. This happens when the map is not visited for a set period of time, define in the configuration file when you compiled the game. And when the map got reseted, which happen when the period of no-player-in-map exceed another time set in that config file, it's fine again. I should have at least put a note in the map to warn players. I couldn't find any other devices that could teleport items. Pentagram was the only one. Sorry. -kundi From owner-crossfire Tue Sep 17 22:15:05 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 22:15:05 +0200 Received: from mailer.scri.fsu.edu (mailer.scri.fsu.edu [144.174.112.142]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 22:15:01 +0200 Received: from indigo2.scri.fsu.edu (indigo2.scri.fsu.edu [144.174.128.47]) by mailer.scri.fsu.edu (8.7.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id QAA11641 for <@mailer.scri.fsu.edu:crossfire@ifi.uio.no>; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 16:14:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: by indigo2.scri.fsu.edu (940816.SGI.8.6.9/931108.SGI.AUTO.ANONFTP) id QAA23285; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 16:15:18 -0400 Date: Tue, 17 Sep 1996 16:15:18 -0400 From: murray@indigo2.scri.fsu.edu (John R. Murray) Message-Id: <199609172015.QAA23285@indigo2.scri.fsu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: CF: Re: bug in map? Cc: murray@indigo2.scri.fsu.edu Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Whoops, sent this to the wrong address; retry: ========== >I wrote: >>I tried to complete the Crown of Might quest from Lake Country... > >Hmm.. I tried it again with a freshly-loaded game and it worked. I've got >a sneaking suspicion... if I can get the game to go into funky-breath-spells >mode again anytime soon, I'm going to try this mechanism again... Yes indeed, I tried it after monsters started spewing length 1 cone spells again, and it did not work. I tried precisely the same order of altars (left to right, connect #'s 13, 12 and 11 in that order) after reloading the game again and it worked. - John R. Murray murray@indigo2.scri.fsu.edu http://www.scri.fsu.edu/~murray/ FSU Aikido Club/North Florida Aikikai home of Miko's Aikido MPEGs and the Tallahassee, FL WWW Aikido online calendar of events From owner-crossfire Tue Sep 17 16:09:36 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 16:09:36 +0200 Received: from mailer.scri.fsu.edu (mailer.scri.fsu.edu [144.174.112.142]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 16:09:27 +0200 Received: from indigo2.scri.fsu.edu (indigo2.scri.fsu.edu [144.174.128.47]) by mailer.scri.fsu.edu (8.7.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id KAA04769 for <@mailer.scri.fsu.edu:crossfire@ifi.uio.no>; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 10:08:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: by indigo2.scri.fsu.edu (940816.SGI.8.6.9/931108.SGI.AUTO.ANONFTP) id KAA21258; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 10:08:58 -0400 Date: Tue, 17 Sep 1996 10:08:58 -0400 From: murray@indigo2.scri.fsu.edu (John R. Murray) Message-Id: <199609171408.KAA21258@indigo2.scri.fsu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: CF: Re: bug in map? Cc: murray@indigo2.scri.fsu.edu Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO I wrote: >I tried to complete the Crown of Might quest from Lake Country... Hmm.. I tried it again with a freshly-loaded game and it worked. I've got a sneaking suspicion... if I can get the game to go into funky-breath-spells mode again anytime soon, I'm going to try this mechanism again... -- John R. Murray murray@indigo2.scri.fsu.edu http://www.scri.fsu.edu/~murray/ FSU Aikido Club/North Florida Aikikai home of Miko's Aikido MPEGs and the Tallahassee, FL WWW Aikido online calendar of events From owner-crossfire Tue Sep 17 15:51:41 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 15:51:41 +0200 Received: from maud.ifi.uio.no (0@maud.ifi.uio.no [129.240.74.2]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 15:51:38 +0200 Received: from mailer.scri.fsu.edu (mailer.scri.fsu.edu [144.174.112.142]) by maud.ifi.uio.no ; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 15:51:28 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from indigo2.scri.fsu.edu (indigo2.scri.fsu.edu [144.174.128.47]) by mailer.scri.fsu.edu (8.7.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id JAA05132 for <@mailer.scri.fsu.edu:crossfire@ifi.uio.no>; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 09:50:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: by indigo2.scri.fsu.edu (940816.SGI.8.6.9/931108.SGI.AUTO.ANONFTP) id JAA21096; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 09:50:21 -0400 Date: Tue, 17 Sep 1996 09:50:21 -0400 From: murray@indigo2.scri.fsu.edu (John R. Murray) Message-Id: <199609171350.JAA21096@indigo2.scri.fsu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: CF: bug in map? Cc: murray@indigo2.scri.fsu.edu Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO I tried to complete the Crown of Might quest from Lake Country (map Lake_Country/shops/Olds_jewel, x=3, y=17). That's the one where you drop one power crystal on each of three altars in the shop. Well, I tried it and the altars did their thing, but nothing else happened. Is it broken? From looking at the map in crossedit, I think I see what is *supposed* to happen, but I don't know enough about pentagrams to point to exactly where it's failing. -- John R. Murray murray@indigo2.scri.fsu.edu http://www.scri.fsu.edu/~murray/ FSU Aikido Club/North Florida Aikikai home of Miko's Aikido MPEGs and the Tallahassee, FL WWW Aikido online calendar of events From owner-crossfire Tue Sep 17 11:30:54 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 11:30:54 +0200 Received: from xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov [128.183.126.216]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 11:25:30 +0200 Received: (from thomas@localhost) by xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (LHEA9504/950407.s1) id FAA02846; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 05:25:14 -0400 Date: Tue, 17 Sep 1996 05:25:14 -0400 From: Brian Thomas Message-Id: <199609170925.FAA02846@xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no, samuli@voimax.voima.jkl.fi Subject: Re: CF: Casting time & spellcasting monsters Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO > From: Samuli Tursas writes: > > Hi there. > > Casting time is actually an upgrade for players. Spellcasting monsters > don't cast spells as often they used to cast without CASTING_TIME defined. > Also monsters lose their spells when player hits them, which sure is an > upgrade for fighters. > > It'd great to have a CASTING_TIME which wouldn't affect monsters at all, > casting time would only affect players. (The game needs downgrade for > spellcasters) > Well, you make some good points. But heres two more points: 1) most of the really tough monsters don't just cast spells, but use 'abilities' also. Abilities arent affected by being hit. 2) most spellcasting players won't be close to (and therefore *hitting*) monsters. Thus, casting time is *mostly* an advantage to fighters. Few magicians can capitalize on this (and, in face it is a pretty stiff limitation). -b.t. > From owner-crossfire Tue Sep 17 10:54:42 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 10:54:42 +0200 Received: from voimax.voima.jkl.fi (samuli@voimax.voima.jkl.fi [193.185.117.34]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 10:54:37 +0200 Received: (from samuli@localhost) by voimax.voima.jkl.fi (8.7.6/8.7.3) id LAA30567 for crossfire@ifi.uio.no; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 11:54:32 +0300 From: Samuli Tursas Message-Id: <199609170854.LAA30567@voimax.voima.jkl.fi> Subject: CF: Casting time & spellcasting monsters Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Date: Tue, 17 Sep 1996 11:54:30 +0300 (EET DST) Content-Type: text Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Hi there. Casting time is actually an upgrade for players. Spellcasting monsters don't cast spells as often they used to cast without CASTING_TIME defined. Also monsters lose their spells when player hits them, which sure is an upgrade for fighters. It'd great to have a CASTING_TIME which wouldn't affect monsters at all, casting time would only affect players. (The game needs downgrade for spellcasters) Samuli Tursas From owner-crossfire Tue Sep 17 07:28:43 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 07:28:43 +0200 Received: from xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov [128.183.126.216]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 07:28:39 +0200 Received: (from thomas@localhost) by xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (LHEA9504/950407.s1) id BAA02648; Tue, 17 Sep 1996 01:28:09 -0400 Date: Tue, 17 Sep 1996 01:28:09 -0400 From: Brian Thomas Message-Id: <199609170528.BAA02648@xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: xkd@csua.berkeley.edu Subject: Re: CF: 1 thought on new spell Cc: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO > From: Kundi Xue writes: > > Just had 1 thought on a new kind of spell. A spell that can only be > casted when there are more than one player cooperate together. Players of > minimal level requirement and spell availability stands in set pattern and > the main caster invoke the spell, that drains sp from each character. e.g. > [snip] I like it! A kind of 'ritual' magic. I would expect that this casting would share experience points equally for kills. Alos, since magic is more powerfull this way, it always has a casting time. Here's a thought-- why not make *all* spells possible as ritual spells. When cast as a rtiual, 2 or more characters share the spellpoint cost (mana or grace, depending on the spell). The trade-off is that ritual spells take time to cast (if CASTING_ TIME is defined, the amount of time is a multiple of the number of spellcasters!) *and* the experience is split. Of course, priests must share the same god in order to cast rituals. Similarly, we take the most unfavorable caster (level, spellpath) to determine the spellpoint cost. We might want to think about making some powerful spells (like retributive strike, meteor swarm, resurrection) *only* available as rituals. On the other hand, we could just raise the casting cost so that this would be the case (try casting a 800 mana incantation on your own!). -b.t. From owner-crossfire Mon Sep 16 18:03:30 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Mon, 16 Sep 1996 18:03:30 +0200 Received: from soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.43.52]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Mon, 16 Sep 1996 18:03:25 +0200 Received: (from xkd@localhost) by soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (8.6.12/8.6.12) id JAA14900 for crossfire@ifi.uio.no; Mon, 16 Sep 1996 09:04:19 -0700 From: Kundi Xue Message-Id: <199609161604.JAA14900@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU> Subject: CF: 1 thought on new spell Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no (Mailist Crossfire) Date: Mon, 16 Sep 1996 09:04:17 -0700 (PDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 679 Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Hello, Just had 1 thought on a new kind of spell. A spell that can only be casted when there are more than one player cooperate together. Players of minimal level requirement and spell availability stands in set pattern and the main caster invoke the spell, that drains sp from each character. e.g. 1) Destrution Beam: 2 characters, 1 behide another, in line with the casting direction, of the minimal level of 20 and the spell learnt. The front one can invoke the spell. 2) Meteor Swarm: 3 or more casters standing in V shape, may not be symatric, with the tip of V pointing to the casting dir, and width of the wing defining the width of meteor shower and strength. -kundi From owner-crossfire Mon Sep 16 03:33:01 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Mon, 16 Sep 1996 03:33:01 +0200 Received: from jsc.mil (annap2.jsc.mil [137.225.250.2]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Mon, 16 Sep 1996 03:32:57 +0200 Received: by annap2.jsc.mil id <5921>; Sun, 15 Sep 1996 21:31:58 -0400 From: "Charles Walden, 266E, x-7753" X-Mailer: SCO System V Mail (version 3.2) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: CF: Wizard Tower Date: Sun, 15 Sep 1996 19:29:02 -0400 Message-Id: <96Sep15.213158edt.5921@annap2.jsc.mil> Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO > > My question has to deal with going from level Mwizard6 to MwizardG >in the wizard tower in Lake_Country. I have the parchment with the word >i'm supposed to say, but I can't seem to get it to work. I keep getting >teleported down to Mwizard0. Anyone have ideas and/or suggestions? >Thanks. > > >Charles Oops .... answered my own question ... *blushing slightly* From owner-crossfire Sun Sep 15 07:20:47 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Sun, 15 Sep 1996 07:20:47 +0200 Received: from xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov [128.183.126.216]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Sun, 15 Sep 1996 07:20:43 +0200 Received: (from thomas@localhost) by xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (LHEA9504/950407.s1) id BAA01206; Sun, 15 Sep 1996 01:20:42 -0400 Date: Sun, 15 Sep 1996 01:20:42 -0400 From: Brian Thomas Message-Id: <199609150520.BAA01206@xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no, jlarge@moe.fcol.com Subject: Re: party system (was: CF: colors 2) Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO >> From: Jason Largen writes: > > Would anyone be interested in an upgraded party system? We are working on it (we all > used to play a lot of muds so making it alot more mudlike) making some simple changes, so that > it splits based on level, displays hps and sps and grace on the party who (might make it > party status once it works right). Anyways just curious. > Sure! One thing you might want to also look into-- I believe that the current party system doesnt hand out experience to the right exp objects. In other words, if you have a spell readied (current skill: wizardry, current experience:magic) and your buddy kills a monster wi his sword (current skill: melee weapons, current experience: physique) you will get experience added to your "magic" category, *not* physique! Every player has the same number of experience objects (always) so this isnt an intractible problem. Probalby a name search of the other party members inventory for the right experience object to add experience to should work. -b.t. > Jason > From owner-crossfire Sun Sep 15 01:21:31 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Sun, 15 Sep 1996 01:21:31 +0200 Received: from moe.fcol.com (jlarge@ns1.fcol.com [204.215.247.3]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Sun, 15 Sep 1996 01:21:26 +0200 Received: (from jlarge@localhost) by moe.fcol.com (8.7/8.6.12) id SAA16884 for crossfire@ifi.uio.no; Sat, 14 Sep 1996 18:22:18 -0400 Date: Sat, 14 Sep 1996 18:22:18 -0400 From: Jason Largen Message-Id: <199609142222.SAA16884@moe.fcol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: CF: colors 2 Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO never mind. got it working. replaced my xpm library and it worked. :) MUCH nicer in color. Would anyone be interested in an upgraded party system? We are working on it (we all used to play a lot of muds so making it alot more mudlike) making some simple changes, so that it splits based on level, displays hps and sps and grace on the party who (might make it party status once it works right). Anyways just curious. Jason From owner-crossfire Sat Sep 14 15:45:00 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Sat, 14 Sep 1996 15:45:00 +0200 Received: from nexus.astro.psu.edu (nexus.astro.psu.edu [128.118.147.20]) by ifi.uio.no with SMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Sat, 14 Sep 1996 15:44:54 +0200 Received: from zaphod.astro.psu.edu by nexus.astro.psu.edu (4.1/Nexus-1.3) id AA00191; Sat, 14 Sep 96 09:45:45 EDT Received: by zaphod.astro.psu.edu (4.1/Client-1.3) id AA14170; Sat, 14 Sep 96 09:44:50 EDT Date: Sat, 14 Sep 96 09:44:50 EDT From: "Brian Thomas" Message-Id: <9609141344.AA14170@zaphod.astro.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: CF: spell casting bug (minor patch) Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO > Samuli Tursas writes: > > Player goes into an area, leaves it and goes in the area again, and after > that spellcasting monsters start to bug. Cone spells have a range of 1 > square. If one area starts to bug, all areas do the same. This makes the game > [snip] Yes. This effect has existed in all versions since 0.92.2. I have been trying to hunt it down, but have not had much success. I agree that this is a severe bug. Can you be more specific about how to make this bug appear? One of my problems with fixing this is that I can't usually get it to happen. I did find one (minor) bug.. in SK_level. Basically, if a multi-square monster cast a spell from a non "head" square, the wrong value of the level would be inherited by the spell. I include a small, minor patch for this. NOTE: I have seen 1 hex spells cast by single- square creatures (ie beholder) so I DONT expect this is the root cause of the bug. Ill try to look into the teleporter bug. Can you recogmend a map which crashes often? -b.t. *** skill_util.c Tue Sep 3 03:50:39 1996 --- sk Sat Sep 14 09:38:51 1996 *************** *** 1422,1432 **** * it should be used anytime a function needs to check the user's * level. */ int SK_level(object *op) { ! int level = op->level; #ifdef ALLOW_SKILLS if(op->type==PLAYER && op->chosen_skill && op->chosen_skill->level!=0) { level = op->chosen_skill->level; } --- 1422,1432 ---- * it should be used anytime a function needs to check the user's * level. */ int SK_level(object *op) { ! int level = op->head?op->head->level:op->level; #ifdef ALLOW_SKILLS if(op->type==PLAYER && op->chosen_skill && op->chosen_skill->level!=0) { level = op->chosen_skill->level; } From owner-crossfire Sat Sep 14 14:49:34 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Sat, 14 Sep 1996 14:49:34 +0200 Received: from voimax.voima.jkl.fi (samuli@voimax.voima.jkl.fi [193.185.117.34]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Sat, 14 Sep 1996 14:49:31 +0200 Received: (from samuli@localhost) by voimax.voima.jkl.fi (8.7.6/8.7.3) id PAA15593 for crossfire@ifi.uio.no; Sat, 14 Sep 1996 15:42:22 +0300 From: Samuli Tursas Message-Id: <199609141242.PAA15593@voimax.voima.jkl.fi> Subject: CF: 0.92.6 - spell bug? Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Date: Sat, 14 Sep 1996 15:42:22 +0300 (EET DST) Content-Type: text Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Hi there. We've been playing crossfire for ages but this new version has few very bad problems. Cone spells bug. Player goes into an area, leaves it and goes in the area again, and after that spellcasting monsters start to bug. Cone spells have a range of 1 square. If one area starts to bug, all areas do the same. This makes the game very unbalanced and easy .. we tried to compile with diffrent spellcasting options, it still bugs. Also the game crashes very often, without any error messages. Just "SIGSEGV received ..blah" (when running with -d -mon options) It seems that teleporters bug somehow. This new version crashes often, with more than 4 players it's not possible to do any quests or anything, the uptime is probably less than 15 minutes. With +6 players it's hardly up for 5 mins or stuff. Btw, try to identify zombie corpses and sell 'em. I did ~20k platinium coins when I was at level 5 :-P ++Samuli Tursas From owner-crossfire Sat Sep 14 00:04:38 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Sat, 14 Sep 1996 00:04:38 +0200 Received: from moe.fcol.com (jlarge@ns1.fcol.com [204.215.247.3]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Sat, 14 Sep 1996 00:04:34 +0200 Received: (from jlarge@localhost) by moe.fcol.com (8.7/8.6.12) id RAA07783 for crossfire@ifi.uio.no; Fri, 13 Sep 1996 17:05:27 -0400 Date: Fri, 13 Sep 1996 17:05:27 -0400 From: Jason Largen Message-Id: <199609132105.RAA07783@moe.fcol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: CF: Crossfire. Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Hi, I compiled and had running just fine the crossfire program and server. Had connections and what not going and several people playing at once. Then i decided to add in the colors and use the .xpm files. Thats when the headache started :). We've tried MANY things, including writing our own programs to make our own bmaps and faces files (which let it compile great, and run kinda ok, the map display was just messed up). So, I would just like it if you could give me an idea since the arch archive has no documents on how to implement the xpm's into the game, what to do to get it working. I know it has to be a LOT simplier than we've made it to be. Jason From owner-crossfire Sun Sep 15 16:15:06 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Sun, 15 Sep 1996 16:15:06 +0200 Received: from maud.ifi.uio.no (1232@maud.ifi.uio.no [129.240.74.2]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Sun, 15 Sep 1996 16:15:03 +0200 Received: (from kjetilho@localhost) by maud.ifi.uio.no ; Sun, 15 Sep 1996 16:15:01 +0200 Message-Id: <199609151415.29495.maud.ifi.uio.no@ifi.uio.no> From: "Charles Walden, 266E, x-7753" Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: CF: Question about the Wizard Tower Date: Fri, 13 Sep 1996 16:04:59 -0400 Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO My question has to deal with going from level Mwizard6 to MwizardG in the wizard tower in Lake_Country. I have the parchment with the word i'm supposed to say, but I can't get seem to get it to work. I keep getting teleported down to Mwizard0. Anyone have ideas and/or suggestions? Thanks. Charles charles@isyscon.jsc.mil / wald2945@cs.fredonia.edu From owner-crossfire Tue Sep 10 19:34:39 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Tue, 10 Sep 1996 19:34:39 +0200 Received: from warrior.real-time.com (root@[206.10.252.1]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Tue, 10 Sep 1996 19:34:35 +0200 Received: from wizard.real-time.com (tanner@wizard.real-time.com [206.10.252.7]) by warrior.real-time.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id MAA03770 for ; Tue, 10 Sep 1996 12:34:30 -0500 (CDT) From: Bob Tanner Received: by wizard.real-time.com (8.7.5) id MAA05416; Tue, 10 Sep 1996 12:30:23 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <199609101730.MAA05416@wizard.real-time.com> Subject: CF: public servers Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Date: Tue, 10 Sep 1996 12:30:23 -0500 (CDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 PGP3 *ALPHA*] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Are there any public server available to play on? I tried to connect to all of the servers listed in the README file, but I get: Can't connect to server: Connection refused Thanks. -- email : tanner@real-time.com | www : http://www.real-time.com/~tanner phone : (612)943-8700 | fax : (612)943-8300 motto : I program, therefore I am | From owner-crossfire Wed Sep 4 09:01:57 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Wed, 4 Sep 1996 09:01:57 +0200 Received: from nexus.astro.psu.edu (nexus.astro.psu.edu [128.118.147.20]) by ifi.uio.no with SMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Wed, 4 Sep 1996 09:01:53 +0200 Received: from zaphod.astro.psu.edu by nexus.astro.psu.edu (4.1/Nexus-1.3) id AA25818; Wed, 4 Sep 96 03:01:07 EDT Received: by zaphod.astro.psu.edu (4.1/Client-1.3) id AA13492; Wed, 4 Sep 96 03:00:10 EDT Date: Wed, 4 Sep 96 03:00:10 EDT From: "Brian Thomas" Message-Id: <9609040700.AA13492@zaphod.astro.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: mwedel@pyramid.com Subject: CF: readable.c part 2 Cc: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Indeed. Formula_msg function doesnt appear!. ie: extern char * formula_msg (int level, int booksize); needs to be added to libproto.h for CF 0.92.6 to compile with ALCHEMY defined. -b.t. From owner-crossfire Tue Sep 3 20:50:41 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Tue, 3 Sep 1996 20:50:41 +0200 Received: from sigma.sm.luth.se (root@sigma.sm.luth.se [130.240.2.1]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Tue, 3 Sep 1996 20:50:36 +0200 Received: from bobe.campus.luth.se (bobe.campus.luth.se [130.240.192.165]) by sigma.sm.luth.se (8.7.2/8.7.2) with SMTP id UAA20607 for ; Tue, 3 Sep 1996 20:50:33 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <322C7C02.18AD@sm.luth.se> Date: Tue, 03 Sep 1996 20:42:11 +0200 From: Thorbjorn X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: CF: cf: A list of servers would be fine? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO Hello! I am looking for some place to play crossfire. I am living in Sweden and played at Chalmers for some years ago but can't find any servers that are open just now. Please give me some address and i will play this very good game. Thorbjorn From owner-crossfire Sun Sep 1 11:35:37 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Sun, 1 Sep 1996 11:35:37 +0200 Received: from gossip.pyramid.com (gossip.pyramid.com [129.214.1.101]) by ifi.uio.no with SMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Sun, 1 Sep 1996 11:35:33 +0200 Received: from stealth-news.pyramid.com by gossip.pyramid.com (5.61/OSx5.1a Pyramid-Internet-Gateway) id AA01276; Sun, 1 Sep 96 02:35:02 -0700 Received: by stealth.eng.pyramid.com (8.6.12/Pyramid_Internal_Configuration) id CAA29565; Sun, 1 Sep 1996 02:34:54 -0700 From: "Mark Wedel" Message-Id: <9609010234.ZM29563@stealth.eng.pyramid.com> Date: Sun, 1 Sep 1996 02:34:53 -0700 In-Reply-To: Brian Thomas "Re: CF: Experience awards with skills, map design" (Sep 1, 4:47am) References: <199609010847.EAA05669@xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov> X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.0 06sep94) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Brian Thomas , crossfire@ifi.uio.no, mwedel@pyramid.com Subject: Re: CF: Experience awards with skills, map design Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO On Sep 1, 4:47am, Brian Thomas wrote: > Subject: Re: CF: Experience awards with skills, map design > > From: "Mark Wedel" writes: > > > > I have noticed that a lot of the cone spells that monsters are casting > > seem pretty wimpy right now - it is almost like NO_CONE_PROPROGATE is > > set no matter what it is set to in teh config.h file. I have really noticed > > this against wyverns - their cone goes 1 space then stops. This makes a lot > > of stuff much easier (even if you are sitting next to the monster and still > > in the area, you are being hit for less time.) > > > > In 0.92.5? Damn. I thought I fixed this. Before, when this > was happening, it was a result of the set_owner code not > seting the spell properties (from the owner) right. Thus, > the wyvern (or whatever) would start casting 0 level spells > which had a range of (you guessed it) 1 (also, the damage > for such spells is quite wimpy too). > > I'll take another look. Again, I havent seen this on my > server in a while. I can't imagine that this is related to > the invoke bug I just patched. Well, I've run into a lot of wyverns and have seen the spell just go one space. There are several wyvern nests you can try this out on. I wonder if I broke it in my version when I changed the spell casting code.. > > > > As said, I fixed the containment bug. But magical cauldrons seem a little > > strange - you don't find +3 sacks or +3 quivers. > > > > Well, the magic value on a cauldron does effect the ability > to make a potion. I have no problem with removing this on > an estetic basis though. > > No problem - if there is some use behind it, it makes sense. Obviously, a +3 sack has no extra use, so doesn't make sense.. -- --Mark From owner-crossfire Sun Sep 1 10:47:07 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Sun, 1 Sep 1996 10:47:07 +0200 Received: from xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov [128.183.126.216]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Sun, 1 Sep 1996 10:47:04 +0200 Received: (from thomas@localhost) by xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (LHEA9504/950407.s1) id EAA05669; Sun, 1 Sep 1996 04:47:03 -0400 Date: Sun, 1 Sep 1996 04:47:03 -0400 From: Brian Thomas Message-Id: <199609010847.EAA05669@xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no, mwedel@pyramid.com Subject: Re: CF: Experience awards with skills, map design Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO > From: "Mark Wedel" writes: > > I have noticed that a lot of the cone spells that monsters are casting > seem pretty wimpy right now - it is almost like NO_CONE_PROPROGATE is > set no matter what it is set to in teh config.h file. I have really noticed > this against wyverns - their cone goes 1 space then stops. This makes a lot > of stuff much easier (even if you are sitting next to the monster and still > in the area, you are being hit for less time.) > In 0.92.5? Damn. I thought I fixed this. Before, when this was happening, it was a result of the set_owner code not seting the spell properties (from the owner) right. Thus, the wyvern (or whatever) would start casting 0 level spells which had a range of (you guessed it) 1 (also, the damage for such spells is quite wimpy too). I'll take another look. Again, I havent seen this on my server in a while. I can't imagine that this is related to the invoke bug I just patched. > > > >I am now carrying a "cauldron +3", which weights only 56. Much > >lighter than the normal cauldron, and I can carry as much as I want > >while still running at top speed. Hmmm... Is that fair? > > > > As said, I fixed the containment bug. But magical cauldrons seem a little > strange - you don't find +3 sacks or +3 quivers. > Well, the magic value on a cauldron does effect the ability to make a potion. I have no problem with removing this on an estetic basis though. -b.t. > > -- > --Mark > From owner-crossfire Sun Sep 1 09:59:06 1996 Return-Path: Received: (from mdomo@localhost) by ifi.uio.no (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for crossfire-ut ; Sun, 1 Sep 1996 09:59:06 +0200 Received: from xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov [128.183.126.216]) by ifi.uio.no with ESMTP (8.6.11/ifi2.4) id for ; Sun, 1 Sep 1996 09:59:03 +0200 Received: (from thomas@localhost) by xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov (LHEA9504/950407.s1) id DAA05653; Sun, 1 Sep 1996 03:59:01 -0400 Date: Sun, 1 Sep 1996 03:59:01 -0400 From: Brian Thomas Message-Id: <199609010759.DAA05653@xplorer.gsfc.nasa.gov> Mime-Version: 1.0 To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no, mwedel@pyramid.com Subject: Re: CF: Re: Gameplay issues Sender: owner-crossfire Precedence: bulk Status: RO >> From: "Mark Wedel" writes: > > What do other people thing about the balance on these maps? I haven't > played them myself (character I am currently working on is not high enough > level.) > Well.. since you solicited it -- :). I think overall these are great maps. Nut, as with any new addtion to the game, there are some unforseen problems for playbalance too. I have played these maps quite a few times when they existed on the berkeley server, so some of what I will suggest changing might have changed. In general, my thoughts are that the quests, while hard, give too many powerfull items, even for the amount of work done. Heres some specific examples: 1) the end items for the "tower of sorcery" are a bit powerful esp the "robe of wizard" (I forget the right name). This robe makes you magic *immune* which, is very, very powerfull. For example, while wearing the robe, if you get your god to mana strike you, you are immune to damage, but any monster standing nearby (like a Jessy!) will be wiped out. I suggest changing the robe to magic *protection*. Also, some of the items that you gather in the tower of sorcery are quite good. The mithril mail the vampire has comes to mind. Also a spell-casting ring. I suggest moving these items to the "regular" end (there is a second, *very* difficult second ending) of the tower quest. 2) Bracers are powerfull, I suggest removing the additional attacktypes. Also, some of the end-quest items in the thieve's guild should be examined for play-balance. Some are ok, others (I fail to remember which) are not. I know that there is some item that gives electric immunity (gauntlets??). I would suggest removing this item (or changing it to electric protection). As has been noted on the list before -- electric immunity is one of the best things you can get; defeating powerful monsters becomes a snap when you get this. 3) the platemail of power can be gotten by bringing 60 dragon scales to the armourer in the castle (also by bringing Monpoon some fairly easy item too?) In addition, Monpoon gives you his +9 dragon fighting sword if you do something (dragon scales). I forget, anyway, *both* items are extremely powerfull, I suggest moving these items to the end of the snake-pit quest (the *most* difficult quest I am aware of in CF). Either place them in a side cave or replace the +10 chaos sword with one or both of them. OR, make these items +5 instead AND put them in the dragon's cave (a side quest on the snakepit). > > >As I wrote to Brian in a separate message, setting the value of the > [snip] > This makes sense. I think brian already sent me the fix for this. > True. The patch I sent basically made the end item a stat-lowering potion ~ 66% of the time (bad enough for you?? =), in addtion, the item value is set to 0. Before there was a smaller chance that the potion would be a stat-lowering item, BUT, the apply code wouldnt lower your stats if you UNCURSED the potion. I fixed that too. -b.t.