From owner-crossfire Sun Aug 1 21:04:48 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Sun, 1 Aug 1993 04:05:03 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from nutmeg (nutmeg-gw.NTU.EDU.AU) by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Sun, 1 Aug 1993 04:04:55 +0200 Received: from localhost (daml@localhost) by nutmeg (8.3/8.3) id LAA27030; Sun, 1 Aug 1993 11:34:48 +0930 Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1993 11:34:48 +0930 From: Damien Lunsford Message-Id: <199308010204.LAA27030@nutmeg> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: client and server Status: RO Hello all, Well a whole bunch of us ran crossfire in pixmap mode cause we can't redefine the fonts on Xterms. Anyway everytime we add a new player everybody has to stop playing cause it seems that if a message appears in the text screen while a person is loggin in it crashes the game. Any Ideas?? Thanks, Damien From owner-crossfire Tue Aug 3 06:08:49 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 03:09:24 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from joyce.cs.su.OZ.AU by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 03:09:05 +0200 Message-Id: <199308030109.AAifi.uio.no09905@ifi.uio.no> Received: from orthanc.cs.su.OZ.AU (for ifi.uio.no) with MHSnet; Tue, 03 Aug 1993 11:08:59 +1000 Subject: Re: map design To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Date: Tue, 3 Aug 93 11:08:49 EST From: Fred the Wonder Worm In-Reply-To: <199308021731.AA04311@cc.lut.fi>; from "Petri Heinil{" at Aug 2, 93 8:31 pm X-Face: )\c`u_%V|7EQUDUt%5v'IJ?=@^Wf^<#,~CjzL`/2q0=-O6XW/Z8A2j.kgg:| 7|YZPSxy}rIuw8qD|/cQZ9^6kb:1XLleXhOl-U>(c~d`bC)%7FItZOUEw?=x%TBQ~NFJ,U|3wi[jzXd5-bMC Reply-To: ftww@cs.su.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.2 PL0] Status: RO >> Most new players have some difficulty to find some interesting maps to >> begin with. The beginner's level was a very useful addition to the >> crossfire world, but we should go one step further : insert a message near >> the entrance of the largest buildings and cities. Each message would give >> some info about the map, its main features, what kind of players should >> enter it, and (at least in the debug versions) the name of the people who >> wrote it. >> >> This could also help the experienced players to find the interesting >> locations in the newest maps. I think that there are too few messages in >> the current maps. (Note : I don't want to spoil the fun of the exploration; >> we have to find a way to describe a map without telling too much about it.) > > This message feature could be build into crossfire. Because, there > is in map-object in maps, a slot for message. It could be invoked > in command line e.g. "mapinfo". This is a possibility, but it would also be good if all of these descriptions could be put into a "Guidebook" file, so that people could read it outside of the game, and pick areas they'd like to try to find/avoid. Then they have to search out the areas they're interested in.... Cheers, Geoff. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Geoff Bailey (Fred the Wonder Worm) | Programmer by trade -- ftww@cs.su.oz.au | Gameplayer by vocation. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-crossfire Tue Aug 3 14:59:56 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 14:59:56 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from cc.lut.fi by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 14:59:52 +0200 Received: by cc.lut.fi (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4/Kim-2.2) id AA00944; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 15:59:48 +0300 From: Tero Haatanen Message-Id: <199308031259.AA00944@cc.lut.fi> Subject: Re: map design To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Date: Tue, 3 Aug 93 15:59:48 EETDST X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Status: RO From: quinet@montefiore.ulg.ac.be (Raphael Quinet) [about map hierachy] I think that in the next version this is done. I have organized my own maps same way like Petri, ie. every multimap building is its own directory. Minimal documentation of map-set might include all "off-area exits" ie. exits which are required to enter/leave area, so map-sets would be easily rearrenged if needed. > - Most new players have some difficulty to find some interesting maps to > begin with. The beginner's level was a very useful addition to the > crossfire world, but we should go one step further : insert a message near > the entrance of the largest buildings and cities. Each message would give > some info about the map, its main features, what kind of players should > enter it, and (at least in the debug versions) the name of the people > who wrote it. Messages are useful describle areas at least recommented level of players. And authors names are good way get feedback their maps. I think that some mapinfo command would be very useful (and easy implement ;). Signs are good for beginners area, since easier to use, but beginners aren't beginners after a while. ;) I like Frank's idea, that starting village contains best beginners areas of game and maybe those areas could be introduced in the guidebook. Other areas info would be nicer get playing the game, like talking NPC's, visiting library and so on. This would required more interactivity from players so you just can't kill everyone ;). One part of fun is find out new things and places, IMHO. > I think that there are too few messages in the current maps. Reason for this is quite clear since messages are quite new thing and most maps are old. > - The new maps should contain at least some of the new archetypes. Look above. Most maps just needs to be updated. > - Some NPC's should be smarter. Use the @match command ! @match is nice start, but it is still very limited. You can do interesting conversations between players and NPC's, and try make somekind of plot to specific maps. One problem with NPC's is that they are easy to kill (even accidentally). In server mode if one kills sage, who knows password, all other players had to wait reset. NPC's can be made harder to kill, but after player has made one angry, it's not help much, especially low lever players. Maybe some kind of punishment is required for killing friendly NPC's. Any ideas? I still wait script language making monsters and other object behave individual (Any progress on this?) -Tero From owner-crossfire Tue Aug 3 19:52:40 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 17:52:44 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from holmenkollen.ifi.uio.no by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 17:52:42 +0200 Received: by holmenkollen.ifi.uio.no ; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 17:52:41 +0200 Message-Id: <199308031552.AAholmenkollen.ifi.uio.no24737@holmenkollen.ifi.uio.no> Subject: Re: Where are servers? To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1993 17:52:40 +0200 (MET DST) In-Reply-To: <199308031505.AA04449@cc.lut.fi> from "Petri Heinil{" at Aug 3, 93 06:05:03 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1120 From: Frank Tore Johansen Status: RO > Btw. Has anybody any idea, how much crossfire loads the network. > CrossFire uses X-protocol, so there goes a lot of small packets. > It uses mainly character, so it's behaviour could be compared to > terminal-programs. But if any has possibility make accurate measurements, > it would be good to know. I tested this a while back, and naturally enough crossfire sent (and received, if anyone had hit a key, though this is usually not the case) one packet for each tick (10 packets / second). However, with the -f switch (using XFlush instead of XSync), X-windows compressed the data into ~7 packets / second. Maybe this will improve with the new slow-net protocol in X11R6. This is for each player, of course... Since it's an arcade game, there isn't really any way to drop below these numbers, even by changing to udp/ip (the game would be unplayable), thus its best to only use servers if you can connect to it across a very fast network. (Like between the Universities in Norway; we have a 34Mb network which seldom has more than 1% load, enabling us to play crossfire and xpilot without any delays 8) -Frank. From owner-crossfire Tue Aug 3 05:48:48 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 02:49:32 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from joyce.cs.su.OZ.AU by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 02:49:12 +0200 Message-Id: <199308030049.AAifi.uio.no08470@ifi.uio.no> Received: from orthanc.cs.su.OZ.AU (for ifi.uio.no) with MHSnet; Tue, 03 Aug 1993 10:48:58 +1000 Subject: Re: Anyone compile on a NeXT? To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Date: Tue, 3 Aug 93 10:48:48 EST From: Fred the Wonder Worm In-Reply-To: <9308022347.AA00613@darmok.uoregon.edu>; from "Jason Fosback" at Aug 2, 93 4:47 pm X-Face: )\c`u_%V|7EQUDUt%5v'IJ?=@^Wf^<#,~CjzL`/2q0=-O6XW/Z8A2j.kgg:| 7|YZPSxy}rIuw8qD|/cQZ9^6kb:1XLleXhOl-U>(c~d`bC)%7FItZOUEw?=x%TBQ~NFJ,U|3wi[jzXd5-bMC Reply-To: ftww@cs.su.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.2 PL0] Status: RO > For future reference, there are compiled Crossfire binaries for > NeXTSTEP on cs.orst.edu [128.193.32.1] in /pub/next/binaries/games. I'm not trying to hassle you, but exactly how helpful is this? In particular, don't you have several compiled in strings (LIBDIR, FONTDIR, COMPRESS,....) that have to be individually set to be useful? Cheers, Geoff. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Geoff Bailey (Fred the Wonder Worm) | Programmer by trade -- ftww@cs.su.oz.au | Gameplayer by vocation. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-crossfire Tue Aug 3 21:19:11 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 17:19:19 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from cc.lut.fi by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 17:19:12 +0200 Received: by cc.lut.fi (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4/Kim-2.2) id AA04836; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 18:19:11 +0300 Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1993 18:19:11 +0300 From: Petri Heinil{ Message-Id: <199308031519.AA04836@cc.lut.fi> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: Anyone compile on a NeXT? Status: RO >From: quinet@montefiore.ulg.ac.be (Raphael Quinet) >> From: Michael Glenn >> ... >> Maybe default Makefiles can be included in the standard distribution, for those whose imake doesn't >> quite function? (Or not...) >> > >Rather dangerous, this... If there's already a Makefile, people are likely >to forget to edit config/crosssite.def, and so the program won't install >properly. On the other hand, if they edit config/crosssite.def, the Makefiles >will be useless ! I don't think, it's dangerous, because when you make Makefile, with depends, it's size becomes to ~20kB's, and the are couple of directories. So playing with Makefiles, is good way to get out of mind :) . >Some time ago, I read a doc file about X Window. It said something like : >"All decent systems using X11 must have imake working properly". :-) Yep :). And O'Reilly has resently published and book of using imake. //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// // Petri Heinila // email: Petri.Heinila@lut.fi // // // mail: Ainonkatu 2A // // // 53100 Lappeenranta // // // Finland, Europe // //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// From owner-crossfire Tue Aug 3 21:05:03 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 17:05:12 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from cc.lut.fi by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 17:05:06 +0200 Received: by cc.lut.fi (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4/Kim-2.2) id AA04449; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 18:05:03 +0300 Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1993 18:05:03 +0300 From: Petri Heinil{ Message-Id: <199308031505.AA04449@cc.lut.fi> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: Where are servers? Status: RO >From: Michael Glenn > >Forgive a newbie if this is common knowledge, but is there a list of server sites currently >available? Or is the game not stable enough to support long distance connections? I have a server >running on fermat.dartmouth.edu (New Hampshire, USA), and welcome any company to help teach me the >ins and outs. Fine. Btw. Has anybody any idea, how much crossfire loads the network. CrossFire uses X-protocol, so there goes a lot of small packets. It uses mainly character, so it's behaviour could be compared to terminal-programs. But if any has possibility make accurate measurements, it would be good to know. Loading the network should keep in mind; working hours, etc. //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// // Petri Heinila // email: Petri.Heinila@lut.fi // // // mail: Ainonkatu 2A // // // 53100 Lappeenranta // // // Finland, Europe // //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// From owner-crossfire Mon Aug 2 22:40:52 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 08:43:15 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from dartvax.dartmouth.edu by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 08:43:12 +0200 Received: from fermat.dartmouth.edu by dartvax.dartmouth.edu (5.65+D5/4.5HUB) id AA20113; Tue, 3 Aug 93 02:43:10 -0400 Received: by fermat.dartmouth.edu (NX5.67d/NX3.0S) id AA01978; Tue, 3 Aug 93 02:40:52 -0400 Date: Tue, 3 Aug 93 02:40:52 -0400 From: Michael Glenn Message-Id: <9308030640.AA01978@fermat.dartmouth.edu> Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.95) Received: by NeXT Mailer (1.95) To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Where are servers? Status: RO Forgive a newbie if this is common knowledge, but is there a list of server sites currently available? Or is the game not stable enough to support long distance connections? I have a server running on fermat.dartmouth.edu (New Hampshire, USA), and welcome any company to help teach me the ins and outs. Michael (P.S., any jugglers who play crossfire?) From owner-crossfire Tue Aug 3 04:02:32 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 01:59:05 +0200 Return-Path: <@vm1.ulg.ac.be:quinet@montefiore.ulg.ac.be> Received: from vm1.ulg.ac.be by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 01:59:02 +0200 Received: from montefiore.ulg.ac.be by vm1.ulg.ac.be (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with TCP; Tue, 03 Aug 93 01:58:07 +0200 Received: from verif1.montefiore.ulg.ac.be by montefiore.ulg.ac.be (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA21996; Tue, 3 Aug 93 02:02:32 +0200 Date: Tue, 3 Aug 93 02:02:32 +0200 From: quinet@montefiore.ulg.ac.be (Raphael Quinet) Message-Id: <9308030002.AA21996@montefiore.ulg.ac.be> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no, fermat@fermat.dartmouth.edu Subject: Re: Anyone compile on a NeXT? Cc: quinet@montefiore.ulg.ac.be Status: RO > From: Michael Glenn > ... > Maybe default Makefiles can be included in the standard distribution, for those whose imake doesn't > quite function? (Or not...) > Rather dangerous, this... If there's already a Makefile, people are likely to forget to edit config/crosssite.def, and so the program won't install properly. On the other hand, if they edit config/crosssite.def, the Makefiles will be useless ! Some time ago, I read a doc file about X Window. It said something like : "All decent systems using X11 must have imake working properly". :-) Raphael Quinet From owner-crossfire Mon Aug 2 09:47:52 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 01:48:12 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from phloem.uoregon.edu (network-services.uoregon.edu) by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 01:48:08 +0200 Received: from darmok.uoregon.edu by phloem.uoregon.edu (4.1/UofO NetSvc-02/16/93) id AA05645; Mon, 2 Aug 93 16:47:53 PDT Received: by darmok.uoregon.edu (NX5.67d/NX3.0S) id AA00613; Mon, 2 Aug 93 16:47:52 -0700 Date: Mon, 2 Aug 93 16:47:52 -0700 From: Jason Fosback Message-Id: <9308022347.AA00613@darmok.uoregon.edu> Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.95) Received: by NeXT Mailer (1.95) To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: Anyone compile on a NeXT? Status: RO For future reference, there are compiled Crossfire binaries for NeXTSTEP on cs.orst.edu [128.193.32.1] in /pub/next/binaries/games. -jason _________________________________________________________________ Jason Fosback, User Support Analyst | No sir, I didn't like it ---- University of Oregon ---- | -R&S Internet: jfosback@oregon.uoregon.edu | Star Trek: NeXT mail: jfosback@darmok.uoregon.edu | The NeXT Generation... From owner-crossfire Tue Aug 3 03:36:41 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 01:33:16 +0200 Return-Path: <@vm1.ulg.ac.be:quinet@montefiore.ulg.ac.be> Received: from vm1.ulg.ac.be by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 01:33:10 +0200 Received: from montefiore.ulg.ac.be by vm1.ulg.ac.be (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with TCP; Tue, 03 Aug 93 01:32:17 +0200 Received: from verif1.montefiore.ulg.ac.be by montefiore.ulg.ac.be (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA21938; Tue, 3 Aug 93 01:36:41 +0200 Date: Tue, 3 Aug 93 01:36:41 +0200 From: quinet@montefiore.ulg.ac.be (Raphael Quinet) Message-Id: <9308022336.AA21938@montefiore.ulg.ac.be> To: Petri.Heinila@lut.fi, crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: map design Cc: quinet@montefiore.ulg.ac.be Status: RO > From: Petri Heinil{ > ... > - filenames between maps are always _relative_, exept the > entering maps in 1st level. this allows easier moving of > directories (= houses, holes, etc. ). Good idea ! > > From: myself :-) > >- Most new players have some difficulty to find some interesting maps to > > begin with. The beginner's level was a very useful addition to the > > crossfire world, but we should go one step further : insert a message near > > the entrance of the largest buildings and cities. Each message would give > > some info about the map, its main features, what kind of players should enter > > it, and (at least in the debug versions) the name of the people who wrote it. > > This could also help the experienced players to find the interesting > > locations in the newest maps. I think that there are too few messages in the > > current maps. (Note : I don't want to spoil the fun of the exploration; we > > have to find a way to describe a map without telling too much about it.) > > This message feature could be build into crossfire. Because, there > is in map-object in maps, a slot for message. It could be invoked > in command line e.g. "mapinfo". I'm not sure that the addition of a new command is the best way to help the beginners. A more "natural" solution is to put some signs on the map. Some of the newest maps already have some "help" signs. This is easy to understand. But, thinking of it, the "map-message" could be a very good place to put some additional info like the name of the people who built the map. This could even be done automatically by CrossEdit. What do you think of this ? > >- The new maps should contain at least some of the new archetypes. > > Making different looking archetypes is easy. Making diffrent behaving > archetypes, needs much more. > I didn't mean that you need to write new archetypes. There are already some archetypes (new monsters, special doors, ...) available in CrossEdit 0.5 that should be present in some maps. Raphael Quinet From owner-crossfire Mon Aug 2 15:32:26 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 01:34:50 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from dartvax.dartmouth.edu by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 01:34:47 +0200 Received: from fermat.dartmouth.edu by dartvax.dartmouth.edu (5.65+D5/4.5HUB) id AA05727; Mon, 2 Aug 93 19:34:45 -0400 Received: by fermat.dartmouth.edu (NX5.67d/NX3.0S) id AA00750; Mon, 2 Aug 93 19:32:26 -0400 Date: Mon, 2 Aug 93 19:32:26 -0400 From: Michael Glenn Message-Id: <9308022332.AA00750@fermat.dartmouth.edu> Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.95) Received: by NeXT Mailer (1.95) To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: Anyone compile on a NeXT? Status: RO To followup on my previous post... I used imake from a decstation, then copied the Makefiles over to my NeXT, modified them slightly, and everything compiled without a hitch. Ok, one small hitch. snprintf() is not in *my* MACH library, so I switched this to sprintf() in tempnam.c. Other than this and a few warnings, it went ok. Maybe default Makefiles can be included in the standard distribution, for those whose imake doesn't quite function? (Or not...) I now have a server running on fermat.dartmouth.edu, at least for a time... Michael From owner-crossfire Mon Aug 2 23:31:57 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Mon, 2 Aug 1993 19:32:01 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from cc.lut.fi by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Mon, 2 Aug 1993 19:31:58 +0200 Received: by cc.lut.fi (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4/Kim-2.2) id AA04311; Mon, 2 Aug 1993 20:31:57 +0300 Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1993 20:31:57 +0300 From: Petri Heinil{ Message-Id: <199308021731.AA04311@cc.lut.fi> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: map design Status: RO >From: quinet@montefiore.ulg.ac.be (Raphael Quinet) > ... >- The LIBDIR/maps directory needs a bit of cleaning (I know this has already > been discussed on this list). I suggest that we have one subdirectory for > each city or village, named after the city itself. The maps should be > renamed, each having the name of the building or location it contains > (bearing in mind the 14 char. limit). If some building needs more than > one map, we could use index numbers. This would lead to something like > this in LIBDIR/maps : I got following system (overall): 0th level - myself :) /ph 1st level - continent /ph/Island 2th level - town /ph/Island/Fireham 3th level - house /ph/Island/Fireham/Hole 4th level - floors /ph/Island/Fireham/Hole/First - in town level the town map itself is named as Town in every town for polymorphism. And every other place I was tried to increase it. - filenames between maps are always _relative_, exept the entering maps in 1st level. this allows easier moving of directories (= houses, holes, etc. ). > This way, we could get rid of all the maps.?? and have an easier way to > identify each map. Yep and indeed. When I got my maps in maps-directory, there seems to be a lot of maps to handle. Now, there seems to nothing to manage with. >- Most new players have some difficulty to find some interesting maps to > begin with. The beginner's level was a very useful addition to the > crossfire world, but we should go one step further : insert a message near > the entrance of the largest buildings and cities. Each message would give > some info about the map, its main features, what kind of players should enter > it, and (at least in the debug versions) the name of the people who wrote it. > This could also help the experienced players to find the interesting > locations in the newest maps. I think that there are too few messages in the > current maps. (Note : I don't want to spoil the fun of the exploration; we > have to find a way to describe a map without telling too much about it.) This message feature could be build into crossfire. Because, there is in map-object in maps, a slot for message. It could be invoked in command line e.g. "mapinfo". >- The new maps should contain at least some of the new archetypes. Making different looking archetypes is easy. Making diffrent behaving archetypes, needs much more. >... //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// // Petri Heinila // email: Petri.Heinila@lut.fi // // // mail: Ainonkatu 2A // // // 53100 Lappeenranta // // // Finland, Europe // //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// From owner-crossfire Mon Aug 2 23:07:32 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Mon, 2 Aug 1993 19:07:36 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from cc.lut.fi by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Mon, 2 Aug 1993 19:07:33 +0200 Received: by cc.lut.fi (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4/Kim-2.2) id AA04036; Mon, 2 Aug 1993 20:07:32 +0300 Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1993 20:07:32 +0300 From: Petri Heinil{ Message-Id: <199308021707.AA04036@cc.lut.fi> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: help! crossedit Status: RO >From: Tyler Van Gorder > >hello....well ive manged to get the new version compiled.....but... >when i try to load a map...... > ... >phantasm /user/s/tvangod/bin > crossedit >Trying to fix fontpath... >Warning: translation table syntax error: Unknown modifier name: None >Warning: ... found while parsing '! None : editInsert(archetype) ' You are confused with X-resources. Only the resource-file Crossedit.ad sould be on work. Those resource warnings seems to come from older version somehow. Check, that Crossedit.ad is traslateted to Crossedit.ad.h in compiling by ad2c-program. //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// // Petri Heinila // email: Petri.Heinila@lut.fi // // // mail: Ainonkatu 2A // // // 53100 Lappeenranta // // // Finland, Europe // //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// From owner-crossfire Sun Aug 1 16:44:28 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Mon, 2 Aug 1993 02:46:28 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from dartvax.dartmouth.edu by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Mon, 2 Aug 1993 02:46:25 +0200 Received: from fermat.dartmouth.edu by dartvax.dartmouth.edu (5.65+D5/4.5HUB) id AA26297; Sun, 1 Aug 93 20:46:22 -0400 Received: by fermat.dartmouth.edu (NX5.67d/NX3.0S) id AA07740; Sun, 1 Aug 93 20:44:28 -0400 Date: Sun, 1 Aug 93 20:44:28 -0400 From: Michael Glenn Message-Id: <9308020044.AA07740@fermat.dartmouth.edu> Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.95) Received: by NeXT Mailer (1.95) To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Anyone compile on a NeXT? Status: RO Has anyone gotten crossfire to compile on a NeXT? I have the MouseX X11R5 server. My imake fails with the following: imake -DUseInstalled -I/usr/lib/X11/config In file included from /usr/lib/X11/config/Imake.tmpl:856, from :3: /tmp/IIf.007737:10: invalid preprocessor directive name imake: Exit code 1. Stop. Any ideas? Michael From owner-crossfire Tue Aug 3 02:26:17 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 18:26:33 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from phloem.uoregon.edu (network-services.uoregon.edu) by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 18:26:29 +0200 Received: from darmok.uoregon.edu by phloem.uoregon.edu (4.1/UofO NetSvc-02/16/93) id AA06411; Tue, 3 Aug 93 09:26:22 PDT Received: by darmok.uoregon.edu (NX5.67d/NX3.0S) id AA01217; Tue, 3 Aug 93 09:26:17 -0700 Date: Tue, 3 Aug 93 09:26:17 -0700 From: Jason Fosback Message-Id: <9308031626.AA01217@darmok.uoregon.edu> Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.95) Received: by NeXT Mailer (1.95) To: ftww@cs.su.oz.au Subject: Re: Anyone compile on a NeXT? Cc: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Status: RO > don't you have several compiled in strings (LIBDIR, FONTDIR, COMPRESS,....) that have to be individually set to be useful? > Yes, and all of that is specified in the extensive README's that are included with the binaries. A lot of people don't have the disk space or the knowledge to compile programs... -jason _________________________________________________________________ Jason Fosback, User Support Analyst | No sir, I didn't like it ---- University of Oregon ---- | -R&S Internet: jfosback@oregon.uoregon.edu | Star Trek: NeXT mail: jfosback@darmok.uoregon.edu | The NeXT Generation... From owner-crossfire Tue Aug 3 02:41:19 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 18:45:09 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from soda.Berkeley.EDU by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 18:45:05 +0200 Received: by soda.berkeley.edu (5.65/KAOS-1) id AA00084; Tue, 3 Aug 93 09:41:20 -0700 From: Matthew L. Seidl Message-Id: <9308031641.AA00084@soda.berkeley.edu> Subject: Multiple comments/suggestions To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1993 09:41:19 -0700 (PDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL5] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1157 Status: RO We've recently gotten a couple of copies of crossfire to compile, and it's a great game!!! But there are a couple of problems that we've seen that I haven't heard mentioned yet. 1) It would be really nice to split the player messages from the game messages and put them in 2 seperate windows. As it is now, if you're fighting a bunch of nasties, it's really easy to miss player messages as they scroll of the screen. 2) The save files should NOT be written out in plain text, as it's too easy to tweek one. We wrote a player from scratch once, just to prove it could be done. 3) Better documentation is a must! The manual and man page is very sparse. 4) Docs on adding new archtypes and new maps on your own would be helpful. 5) And, the eternal beef, some better way for players to interact with the NPC's. Overall though, the game looks great! I can't wait for the next version. -=- Matt Seidl -=- Matthew L. Seidl email: seidl@soda.berkeley.edu =-= =-= CSUA President Project . . . What Project? -=- -=- CEA SWAT Tester We're here to make your life better!=-= =-= and all arround cool guy - Famous Morrow Quotes -=- From owner-crossfire Tue Aug 3 04:57:17 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 03:27:24 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from DARWIN.NTU.EDU.AU by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 03:27:14 +0200 Received: from dme.nt.gov.au ([155.205.2.1]) by DARWIN.NTU.EDU.AU with SMTP; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 10:59:38 GMT Received: from pangaea.dme by dme.nt.gov.au (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA05897; Tue, 3 Aug 93 10:56:47 CST Received: from daml.dme by pangaea.dme (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA03223; Tue, 3 Aug 93 10:57:17 CST Date: Tue, 3 Aug 93 10:57:17 CST From: daml@pangaea.dme.nt.gov.au (Damien Lunsford 61-89-895256) Message-Id: <9308030127.AA03223@pangaea.dme> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: pixmaps Status: RO I found that when I ran a client in pixmap mode and tried to join to a server. Everybody had to stop typing or else it would crash the game. Any ideas?? Damien From owner-crossfire Tue Aug 3 03:44:22 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 19:44:51 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from phloem.uoregon.edu (network-services.uoregon.edu) by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 19:44:39 +0200 Received: from darmok.uoregon.edu by phloem.uoregon.edu (4.1/UofO NetSvc-02/16/93) id AA13174; Tue, 3 Aug 93 10:44:23 PDT Received: by darmok.uoregon.edu (NX5.67d/NX3.0S) id AA01378; Tue, 3 Aug 93 10:44:22 -0700 Date: Tue, 3 Aug 93 10:44:22 -0700 From: Jason Fosback Message-Id: <9308031744.AA01378@darmok.uoregon.edu> Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.95) Received: by NeXT Mailer (1.95) To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: Multiple comments/suggestions Status: RO > 2) The save files should NOT be written out in plain text, as it's > too easy to tweek one. We wrote a player from scratch once, just > to prove it could be done. I agree that it's easy to tweak one, but the sysadmin can set the game up so that no one can tweak their characters. Also, changing the character file to a binary format introduces a huge can of worms for portability. Definitely something to be avoided. -jason _________________________________________________________________ Jason Fosback, User Support Analyst | No sir, I didn't like it ---- University of Oregon ---- | -R&S Internet: jfosback@oregon.uoregon.edu | Star Trek: NeXT mail: jfosback@darmok.uoregon.edu | The NeXT Generation... From owner-crossfire Tue Aug 3 23:02:20 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 20:59:07 +0200 Return-Path: <@vm1.ulg.ac.be:quinet@montefiore.ulg.ac.be> Received: from vm1.ulg.ac.be by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Tue, 3 Aug 1993 20:59:00 +0200 Received: from montefiore.ulg.ac.be by vm1.ulg.ac.be (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with TCP; Tue, 03 Aug 93 20:58:00 +0200 Received: from verif1.montefiore.ulg.ac.be by montefiore.ulg.ac.be (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA24583; Tue, 3 Aug 93 21:02:20 +0200 Date: Tue, 3 Aug 93 21:02:20 +0200 From: quinet@montefiore.ulg.ac.be (Raphael Quinet) Message-Id: <9308031902.AA24583@montefiore.ulg.ac.be> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no, seidl@soda.berkeley.edu Subject: Re: Multiple comments/suggestions Cc: quinet@montefiore.ulg.ac.be Status: RO > From: Matthew L. Seidl > 1) It would be really nice to split the player messages from the game messages > and put them in 2 seperate windows. As it is now, if you're fighting a > bunch of nasties, it's really easy to miss player messages as they scroll of > the screen. Yes, something should be done with the scrolling in the message window. But is splitting the window the only solution ? Any suggestions ? > 2) The save files should NOT be written out in plain text, as it's too easy > to tweek one. We wrote a player from scratch once, just to prove it could > be done. Better leave the files in plain text. Here's why : - if there is a checksum/CRC in the file, this is not an easy task to write a player from scratch. - if the game is run setuid/setgid, the system will be more secure. - the plain text format is useful for (human) debuggers. - anything you do at your local site to cheat with the game is your problem. - if you want to cheat without using the "dm" mode, just insert a tweaked artifact in one of your maps, like the Holy Avenger with "dam 50", "immune" to what you want, "Str 10", "Con 10", and so on... > 3) Better documentation is a must! The manual and man page is very sparse. Yes, but it's a game where you learn by playing. Many other things need to be fixed in the program itself and the docs are another problem. > 4) Docs on adding new archtypes and new maps on your own would be helpful. Did you look in the "doc" directory ? I think that crossedit (0.5) is rather easy to use and understand if you want to add new maps. > 5) And, the eternal beef, some better way for players to interact with the > NPC's. Yes, I agree ! Is there someone working seriously :) on this ? Raphael Quinet quinet@montefiore.ulg.ac.be From owner-crossfire Wed Aug 4 02:15:44 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Wed, 4 Aug 1993 00:15:47 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from hymir.ifi.uio.no by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Wed, 4 Aug 1993 00:15:45 +0200 Received: by hymir.ifi.uio.no ; Wed, 4 Aug 1993 00:15:44 +0200 Date: Wed, 4 Aug 1993 00:15:44 +0200 Message-Id: <199308032215.AAhymir.ifi.uio.no13610@hymir.ifi.uio.no> To: crossfire Subject: Re: map design From: Lars Henrik Olafsen Status: RO Hi! Some superfluous nagging.... > Petri Heinil wrote some time ago: > >I got following system (overall): > 0th level - myself :) /ph > 1st level - continent /ph/Island > 2th level - town /ph/Island/Fireham > 3th level - house /ph/Island/Fireham/Hole > 4th level - floors /ph/Island/Fireham/Hole/First Why do you have to start with the ph directory ? Wouldn't it be somewhat easier to navigate through the map hierarchy without needing to know the authors names ? E.g You know there is a bug in the 'hole' in Fireham .. So, where the heck is it?? ... etc. -Lars From owner-crossfire Wed Aug 4 20:37:41 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Wed, 4 Aug 1993 16:37:49 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from cc.lut.fi by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Wed, 4 Aug 1993 16:37:46 +0200 Received: by cc.lut.fi (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4/Kim-2.2) id AA04746; Wed, 4 Aug 1993 17:37:41 +0300 Date: Wed, 4 Aug 1993 17:37:41 +0300 From: Petri Heinil{ Message-Id: <199308041437.AA04746@cc.lut.fi> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: map design Status: RO >From: Fred the Wonder Worm > ... >> This message feature could be build into crossfire. Because, there >> is in map-object in maps, a slot for message. It could be invoked >> in command line e.g. "mapinfo". > >This is a possibility, but it would also be good if all of these descriptions >could be put into a "Guidebook" file, so that people could read it outside of >the game, and pick areas they'd like to try to find/avoid. Then they have to >search out the areas they're interested in.... Hmm, this makes a another file-system to maintain. And map descriptions are context-sensitive ie. you have to write more for reading decription separately from map. And arcade view to game is maybe loss, whn looking out safely files, instead going to unknown map, thinking what comes next. //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// // Petri Heinila // email: Petri.Heinila@lut.fi // // // mail: Ainonkatu 2A // // // 53100 Lappeenranta // // // Finland, Europe // //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// From owner-crossfire Tue Aug 3 12:24:50 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Wed, 4 Aug 1993 04:26:21 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from hairball.ecst.csuchico.edu by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Wed, 4 Aug 1993 04:26:11 +0200 Received: by hairball.ecst.csuchico.edu (1.37.109.4/16.2) id AA19602; Tue, 3 Aug 93 19:24:50 -0700 From: Tyler Van Gorder Message-Id: <9308040224.AA19602@hairball.ecst.csuchico.edu> Subject: Re: Multiple comments/suggestions To: seidl@soda.berkeley.edu (Matthew L. Seidl) Date: Tue, 3 Aug 93 19:24:50 PDT Cc: crossfire@ifi.uio.no In-Reply-To: <9308031641.AA00084@soda.berkeley.edu>; from "Matthew L. Seidl" at Aug 3, 93 9:41 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Status: RO > 2) The save files should NOT be written out in plain text, as it's too easy > to tweek one. We wrote a player from scratch once, just to prove it could > be done. Well, soon this wont be so easy...as there is code that creates a checksum.. of course if you really really want to create a player...you could always figure out the checksum too....but in most cases this should be sufficient... running a server here locally, I have found a couple of players that had altered their characters.....soooo...i have added a little chunk of code which keeps track of their login names...and well if their login names are in my "cheaters" file...well i dont let them do much in the game :> of course there is nothing stopping them from going and compiling their own server.... :> > 3) Better documentation is a must! The manual and man page is very sparse. > 4) Docs on adding new archtypes and new maps on your own would be helpful. > Docs have been written...will probably be with the next release. > 5) And, the eternal beef, some better way for players to interact with the > NPC's. > Also look for this in the next release....players can say stuff to monsters and monsters can respond by matching parts of strings.... I believe also that Frank mentioned something about having voice activated switches...you say a certain word...in a certain spot...and presto... a door opens...or a wall disappears :> :> The next release will have a lot of cool enhancements! > Overall though, the game looks great! I can't wait for the next version. > > -=- Matt Seidl > > -=- Matthew L. Seidl email: seidl@soda.berkeley.edu =-= > =-= CSUA President Project . . . What Project? -=- > -=- CEA SWAT Tester We're here to make your life better!=-= > =-= and all arround cool guy - Famous Morrow Quotes -=- > you happen to know Passing Wind?? he goes to school down there at Berkeley.. tell him Skud said hi :> from netrek :> From owner-crossfire Wed Aug 4 20:44:34 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Wed, 4 Aug 1993 16:45:04 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from cc.lut.fi by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Wed, 4 Aug 1993 16:44:38 +0200 Received: by cc.lut.fi (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4/Kim-2.2) id AA04855; Wed, 4 Aug 1993 17:44:34 +0300 Date: Wed, 4 Aug 1993 17:44:34 +0300 From: Petri Heinil{ Message-Id: <199308041444.AA04855@cc.lut.fi> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: map design Status: RO >From: quinet@montefiore.ulg.ac.be (Raphael Quinet) > ... >I'm not sure that the addition of a new command is the best way to help the >beginners. A more "natural" solution is to put some signs on the map. Some >of the newest maps already have some "help" signs. This is easy to understand. Yes, indeed, it's better to use items in map. It gives better feeling of playing. >But, thinking of it, the "map-message" could be a very good place to put some >additional info like the name of the people who built the map. This could >even be done automatically by CrossEdit. What do you think of this ? Yes, this is better way to do it. This put into TODO-list :) . //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// // Petri Heinila // email: Petri.Heinila@lut.fi // // // mail: Ainonkatu 2A // // // 53100 Lappeenranta // // // Finland, Europe // //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// From owner-crossfire Wed Aug 4 21:00:17 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Wed, 4 Aug 1993 17:00:22 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from cc.lut.fi by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Wed, 4 Aug 1993 17:00:18 +0200 Received: by cc.lut.fi (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4/Kim-2.2) id AA05168; Wed, 4 Aug 1993 18:00:17 +0300 Date: Wed, 4 Aug 1993 18:00:17 +0300 From: Petri Heinil{ Message-Id: <199308041500.AA05168@cc.lut.fi> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: map design Status: RO >From: Lars Henrik Olafsen >> ... >>I got following system (overall): >> 0th level - myself :) /ph >> 1st level - continent /ph/Island >> 2th level - town /ph/Island/Fireham >> 3th level - house /ph/Island/Fireham/Hole >> 4th level - floors /ph/Island/Fireham/Hole/First > > >Why do you have to start with the ph directory ? >Wouldn't it be somewhat easier to navigate through the map hierarchy >without needing to know the authors names ? Criteria for this is mainentance. I have here: aino:/net/contrib/crossfire/lib/maps>ls -ld ph lrwxrwxrwx 1 hevi 40 Jul 12 19:03 ph -> /net/surukuku/wrk/hevi/crossfire/ph/maps so I can convient keep my maps in my own work disk, or move them easy across file system. And when making distribution, it easier make tar below one directory. Maybe, it would be more logical to have "root" at continent level. Anyway, target is, I think, there is under 20 files in directory. >E.g You know there is a bug in the 'hole' in Fireham .. > So, where the heck is it?? ... etc. To being more exact say: "there is a bug in /ph/Island/Fireham/Hole/First" :) //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// // Petri Heinila // email: Petri.Heinila@lut.fi // // // mail: Ainonkatu 2A // // // 53100 Lappeenranta // // // Finland, Europe // //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// From owner-crossfire Fri Aug 6 01:09:25 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Thu, 5 Aug 1993 23:09:28 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from yrsa.ifi.uio.no by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Thu, 5 Aug 1993 23:09:27 +0200 Received: by yrsa.ifi.uio.no ; Thu, 5 Aug 1993 23:09:26 +0200 Message-Id: <199308052109.AAyrsa11987@yrsa.ifi.uio.no> Subject: Re: map design To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Date: Thu, 5 Aug 1993 23:09:25 +0200 (MET DST) In-Reply-To: <199308041500.AA05168@cc.lut.fi> from "Petri Heinil{" at Aug 4, 93 06:00:17 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 770 From: Frank Tore Johansen Status: RO > Maybe, it would be more logical to have "root" at continent level. I support a root at continent level... > Anyway, target is, I think, there is under 20 files in directory. 20 sounds like a nice number to me as well. There is absolutely no rule stating that mapcreators can't cooperate; that you can't add maps to a previously made continent... Just take contact with its creator and I'm sure it'll work out. This way we won't end up with more continents than we have maps to support...Would be boring with lots of outdoor maps if they have no further exits... Petri, can you add support in the editor, to easily add a string to each map, stating who made it? (just use some available string in the map-object.) (I'll make it readable from the game.) -Frank. From owner-crossfire Fri Aug 6 22:25:00 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Fri, 6 Aug 1993 18:25:06 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from cc.lut.fi by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Fri, 6 Aug 1993 18:25:01 +0200 Received: by cc.lut.fi (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4/Kim-2.2) id AA28163; Fri, 6 Aug 1993 19:25:00 +0300 Date: Fri, 6 Aug 1993 19:25:00 +0300 From: Petri Heinil{ Message-Id: <199308061625.AA28163@cc.lut.fi> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: map design Status: RO >From: Frank Tore Johansen > ... >Petri, can you add support in the editor, to easily add a string >to each map, stating who made it? (just use some available string >in the map-object.) (I'll make it readable from the game.) Yep, to msg-variable in map-object. I think someting like: /plah/mapname created by Name Name at 10.20.1993, contact by luser@host. Name and luser@host comes from X-resources. //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// // Petri Heinila // email: Petri.Heinila@lut.fi // // // mail: Ainonkatu 2A // // // 53100 Lappeenranta // // // Finland, Europe // //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// From owner-crossfire Sun Aug 8 19:15:09 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Mon, 9 Aug 1993 05:16:17 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from PO2.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Mon, 9 Aug 1993 05:16:14 +0200 Received: from localhost (postman@localhost) by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (8.5/8.5) id XAA04286; Sun, 8 Aug 1993 23:16:04 -0400 Received: via switchmail; Sun, 8 Aug 1993 23:15:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: from redrum.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Sun, 8 Aug 1993 23:15:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: from redrum.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Sun, 8 Aug 1993 23:15:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from BatMail.robin.v2.13.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.redrum.andrew.cmu.edu.sun4c.411 via MS.5.6.redrum.andrew.cmu.edu.sun4c_411; Sun, 8 Aug 1993 23:15:09 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1993 23:15:09 -0400 (EDT) From: "Eric A. Anderson" To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: Where are servers? In-Reply-To: <199308031552.AAholmenkollen.ifi.uio.no24737@holmenkollen.ifi.uio.no> References: <199308031552.AAholmenkollen.ifi.uio.no24737@holmenkollen.ifi.uio.no> Status: RO Experience at CMU has shown that you can't successfully play if your network lag is too high. This could be helped by snagging the Xmultisync stuff from the xtank distribution. mainly because you still want to do synchronizes because otherwise the animation can be very very jerky. In theory it should be possible to make the game work as does netrek, which is playable if slightly painful between CMU and Berkley. (~100 ms net lag) -Eric ********************************************************* "It seemed like a good idea at the time" -The Mad Hatter "Yes, you're very smart. Shut up." -In "The Princess Bride" ********************************************************* From owner-crossfire Sun Aug 8 15:11:44 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Mon, 9 Aug 1993 07:11:52 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from halcyon.com (chinook.halcyon.com) by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Mon, 9 Aug 1993 07:11:49 +0200 Received: by halcyon.com id AA24356 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for crossfire@ifi.uio.no); Sun, 8 Aug 1993 22:11:44 -0700 Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1993 22:11:44 -0700 From: Jonathan Roy Message-Id: <199308090511.AA24356@halcyon.com> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no, eanders+@CMU.EDU Subject: Re: Where are servers? Status: RO How about using a UDP type protocol, and using the Netrek style of synchronization? From owner-crossfire Mon Aug 9 19:15:07 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Tue, 10 Aug 1993 05:17:01 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from PO2.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Tue, 10 Aug 1993 05:16:56 +0200 Received: from localhost (postman@localhost) by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (8.5/8.5) id XAA13847; Mon, 9 Aug 1993 23:16:52 -0400 Received: via switchmail; Mon, 9 Aug 1993 23:16:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from redrum.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 9 Aug 1993 23:15:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: from redrum.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 9 Aug 1993 23:15:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: from BatMail.robin.v2.13.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.redrum.andrew.cmu.edu.sun4c.411 via MS.5.6.redrum.andrew.cmu.edu.sun4c_411; Mon, 9 Aug 1993 23:15:06 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1993 23:15:07 -0400 (EDT) From: "Eric A. Anderson" To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: Where are servers? In-Reply-To: <199308090511.AA24356@halcyon.com> References: <199308090511.AA24356@halcyon.com> Status: RO Jonathan Roy writes: > How about using a UDP type protocol, and using the Netrek style of > synchronization? I'm actually of the opinion that using tcp is a better idea if you are willing to assume you will have < 50 or so connections. Simply because you don't then have to worry about resending and ordering and all of those problems. This has actually been mentioned a long time ago, and Frank said that he might get a chance to work on it. It's a hard piece to do though. It would however greatly improve the long distance playability of the game. -Eric ********************************************************* "It seemed like a good idea at the time" -The Mad Hatter "Yes, you're very smart. Shut up." -In "The Princess Bride" ********************************************************* From owner-crossfire Mon Aug 9 12:06:03 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Tue, 10 Aug 1993 04:06:14 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from halcyon.com (chinook.halcyon.com) by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Tue, 10 Aug 1993 04:06:10 +0200 Received: by halcyon.com id AA04128 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for kjetilho@ifi.uio.no); Mon, 9 Aug 1993 19:06:03 -0700 Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1993 19:06:03 -0700 From: Jonathan Roy Message-Id: <199308100206.AA04128@halcyon.com> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no, kjetilho@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: Where are servers? Status: RO It may be better to only play locally, but using an intelligent client is still good programming practice. Today's bandwidth problems are tommorro'w smemory. and people will still want to play lagged Corssire anywyas. I still play lagged Netrek. :) From owner-crossfire Mon Aug 9 21:52:49 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Mon, 9 Aug 1993 19:52:52 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from sognsvann.ifi.uio.no by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Mon, 9 Aug 1993 19:52:49 +0200 Received: by sognsvann.ifi.uio.no ; Mon, 9 Aug 1993 19:52:49 +0200 Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1993 19:52:49 +0200 Message-Id: <199308091752.AAsognsvann.ifi.uio.no18323@sognsvann.ifi.uio.no> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no In-Reply-To: Jonathan Roy's message of Mon, 9 Aug 1993 09:53:23 -0700 <199308091653.AA11038@halcyon.com> Subject: Re: Where are servers? From: Kjetil Torgrim Homme Status: RO The first important thing to consider is that crossfire doesn't have a client. You can ask the server to let you in remotely, but once the window is on your screen, the client will be terminated. Second, UDP means you'll have to accept packet-loss. I don't think crossfire is suited to this - you want to know if that beholder casts an icestorm on you... You'll also have to accept that packets can arrive out of order. In other words, if crossfire should use UDP, it would basically have to re-implement TCP on top of it. Keep in mind that XPilot actually uses more bandwidth now that it is based on UDP, because there's redundancy in the packets so that it can recover if some are lost. There's no doubt, however, that crossfire needs to move away from the dependency on the X-protocol, and I can think of some neat optimisations an intelligent client enables us to do. Doing this will be a lot of work, though. I think Crossfire will always be a fairly network intensive game, and with current bandwidths, we may just as well stick to our local networks where X will do the job for us. Kjetil T. PS. Oh yeah, Ackerendam (tentative name for the new base town) will be somewhat bigger :-) From owner-crossfire Mon Aug 9 02:53:23 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Mon, 9 Aug 1993 18:53:51 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from halcyon.com by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Mon, 9 Aug 1993 18:53:46 +0200 Received: by halcyon.com id AA11038 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for crossfire@ifi.uio.no); Mon, 9 Aug 1993 09:53:23 -0700 Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1993 09:53:23 -0700 From: Jonathan Roy Message-Id: <199308091653.AA11038@halcyon.com> To: Petri.Heinila@lut.fi, crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: Where are servers? Cc: h@halcyon.com Status: RO Hmm... Maybe we could convince Andy McFadden to write it? I think that's hte guy who invented UDP for Netrek... Actully he doesn't write a real 'client'. His UDP code is just alibrary sort of thing that perople compile into the Netrek clients... It should be possible ot implement that protocol into crossfice the same way. (The crossfire client that is....) I'd love to see that sort of client. Then if epopel got laggedfit wouldnt' effect anyone els,e and we could have a huge national server. :) Maybe 100 peopole at once? :D :D :D Of course, we'd need lots of new, larger, maps to support adventuring parties, and a far larger city. (ONly a dozen or two people can even fit in the city at once...) :) From owner-crossfire Mon Aug 9 21:46:58 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Mon, 9 Aug 1993 17:47:03 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from cc.lut.fi by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Mon, 9 Aug 1993 17:47:00 +0200 Received: by cc.lut.fi (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4/Kim-2.2) id AA13082; Mon, 9 Aug 1993 18:46:58 +0300 Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1993 18:46:58 +0300 From: Petri Heinil{ Message-Id: <199308091546.AA13082@cc.lut.fi> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: Where are servers? Status: RO >From: Jonathan Roy > >How about using a UDP type protocol, and using the Netrek style of >synchronization? Xpilot uses it and it seems to work fine. But it`s a very low level protocol, and there should to be someone, who has experience or knowledge of it. //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// // Petri Heinila // email: Petri.Heinila@lut.fi // // // mail: Ainonkatu 2A // // // 53100 Lappeenranta // // // Finland, Europe // //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// From owner-crossfire Thu Aug 12 21:58:16 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Thu, 12 Aug 1993 17:58:23 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from cc.lut.fi by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Thu, 12 Aug 1993 17:58:21 +0200 Received: by cc.lut.fi (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4/Kim-2.2) id AA27640; Thu, 12 Aug 1993 18:58:16 +0300 Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1993 18:58:16 +0300 From: Petri Heinil{ Message-Id: <199308121558.AA27640@cc.lut.fi> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: Maps for 0.89.3 Status: RO >From: Till Brychcy > ... >crossedit-0.5 seems to contain crossfire version 0.89.3, but without >images and maps. It supplies a mapconv-script which converts the maps >for 0.89.0 partly to the format required by the new versions, but in >the new version, a new field 'connected', for which previously the 'sp' >field was used. To fix this, I wrote the following perl-script. >Maybe you find this useful. Unfornately CrossEdit 0.5 -package is still developmental (and version 0.89.3 is also too, not official. ) So there are "features" not working quite well yet. Thanx for a script. ( I wrote also it, but I was too lazy to made it commonly usable :) ). //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// // Petri Heinila // email: Petri.Heinila@lut.fi // // // mail: Ainonkatu 2A // // // 53100 Lappeenranta // // // Finland, Europe // //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// From owner-crossfire Thu Aug 12 06:58:25 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Thu, 12 Aug 1993 16:58:32 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from virginia.edu (uvaarpa.Virginia.EDU) by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Thu, 12 Aug 1993 16:58:29 +0200 Received: from sonja.math.virginia.edu by uvaarpa.virginia.edu id aa02585; 12 Aug 93 10:58 EDT Received: by sonja.math.Virginia.EDU (NX5.67c/NX3.0S) id AA00898; Thu, 12 Aug 93 10:58:25 -0400 Date: Thu, 12 Aug 93 10:58:25 -0400 From: "Kevin H. Weiss" Message-Id: <9308121458.AA00898@sonja.math.Virginia.EDU> Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.87.1) Received: by NeXT Mailer (1.87.1) To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Public Server Sonja.math.Virginia.EDU Status: RO Server: sonja.math.Virginia.EDU (128.143.20.19) Hours: 24 hours per day, 7 days per week This is a server running on a NeXT with 20MB RAM, and hopefully enough disk space to comfortably run with several players. --== WARNING ==-- DON'T USE THIS SERVER IF YOU CAN'T USE THE FONTS. RUNNING IN PIX-MODE WILL CRASH IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Local configuration stuff: It's a standard server, except that when you die, you will start again from the last time you saved your character. -------------------------------------------------------------- Kevin Weiss aka Dude the Mage Department of Mathematics khw2x@sonja.math.Virginia.edu (NeXT mail) University of Virginia khw2x@virginia.edu (Non-NeXT mail) From owner-crossfire Thu Aug 12 18:51:20 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Thu, 12 Aug 1993 16:52:19 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from tuminfo2.informatik.tu-muenchen.de by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Thu, 12 Aug 1993 16:52:00 +0200 Received: from papa.informatik.tu-muenchen.de ([131.159.8.79]) by tuminfo2.informatik.tu-muenchen.de with SMTP id <57713>; Thu, 12 Aug 1993 16:51:54 +0200 Received: by papa.informatik.tu-muenchen.de id <42318>; Thu, 12 Aug 1993 16:51:29 +0200 From: Till Brychcy To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Perlscript to replace missing bitmaps with default Cc: brychcy@papa.informatik.tu-muenchen.de Message-Id: <93Aug12.165129met_dst.42318@papa.informatik.tu-muenchen.de> Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1993 16:51:20 +0200 Status: RO Hi, I'm missing some bitmaps for some archetypes used in crossfire 0.89.3. This sometimes completely messes up the display. So I wrote the following perl-script, which replaces these with a default character (277, which is a filled square). Wouldn't it be nice if crossfire itself could do this if necessary? I'm not a X11-Guru, but I don't think it would be much work to implement this. A special-missing-bitmap might be useful for such a case. -Till --Snip snip 8<--------------------------------------- #!/usr/local/bin/perl # Usage: replacefaces archetypes.fixed # bmaps must be in the current directory eval "exec /usr/local/bin/perl -S $0 $*" if $running_under_some_shell; # this emulates #! processing on NIH machines. # (remove #! line above if indigestible) eval '$'.$1.'$2;' while $ARGV[0] =~ /^([A-Za-z_]+=)(.*)/ && shift; # process any FOO=bar switches open(AX,"bmaps") || die "missing bmaps" ; while() { if(/^\\([0-9]+)/){ $char{$1}=1; } } close(AX); $[ = 1; # set array base to 1 while (<>) { if(/^face ([0-9]+)/) { if (!defined($char{$1})) { printf (("face 277\n")); warn "replacing $1"; } else { print $_; } } else { print $_; } } From owner-crossfire Thu Aug 12 18:38:35 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Thu, 12 Aug 1993 16:39:20 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from tuminfo2.informatik.tu-muenchen.de by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Thu, 12 Aug 1993 16:39:15 +0200 Received: from papa.informatik.tu-muenchen.de ([131.159.8.79]) by tuminfo2.informatik.tu-muenchen.de with SMTP id <57713>; Thu, 12 Aug 1993 16:39:06 +0200 Received: by papa.informatik.tu-muenchen.de id <42318>; Thu, 12 Aug 1993 16:38:45 +0200 From: Till Brychcy To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Maps for 0.89.3 Message-Id: <93Aug12.163845met_dst.42318@papa.informatik.tu-muenchen.de> Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1993 16:38:35 +0200 Status: RO Hi, I grabbed crossfire-0.89.2.tar.Z, crossfire-0.89.maps.tar.Z and incoming/crossedit-0.5.tar.Z from ftp.ifi.uoi.no:crossfire/ crossedit-0.5 seems to contain crossfire version 0.89.3, but without images and maps. It supplies a mapconv-script which converts the maps for 0.89.0 partly to the format required by the new versions, but in the new version, a new field 'connected', for which previously the 'sp' field was used. To fix this, I wrote the following perl-script. Maybe you find this useful. Anyway, thanks for crossfire! -Till ---Cut here 8<---------------------------------- #!/usr/local/bin/perl -i.bak # fixconnections: in crossfire 0.89.3, which comes with crossedit 0.5, # connections between buttons and gates etc. do no longer # use the sp field but have an extra 'connected' field # exits, trapdoors and teleporters still # use the sp field for the y position. holes do need both. # In some maps, where sp was 0, sp was completely omitted. # Some other stuff uses sp, too. # To get maps for 0.89.3 from the maps for 0.89.0, cd to maps, # first run the mapconv-skript supplied with crossedit 0.5, # then rm *.oo *.om, then run this skript # fixconnections *, then rm *.bak eval "exec /usr/local/bin/perl -S $0 $*" if $running_under_some_shell; # this emulates #! processing on NIH machines. # (remove #! line above if indigestible) eval '$'.$1.'$2;' while $ARGV[0] =~ /^([A-Za-z_]+=)(.*)/ && shift; # process any FOO=bar switches open(AT,"../archetypes") || die "aargh"; while () { ($Fld1,$Fld2) = split(' ', $_, 9999); if (/^Object /) { $obj = $Fld2; $xy = 0; $conn = 0; } if (/^type 66$/) { $xy = 1; } if (/^type 41$/) { $xy = 1; } if (/^type 9[45]$/) { $xy = 1; } if (/^type 9[1-4]$/) { $conn = 1; } if (/^type 1[78]$/) { $conn = 1; } if (/^type 2[679]$/) { $conn = 1; } if (/^type 3[012]$/) { $conn = 1; } if (/^type 62$/) { $conn = 1; } if (/^type 112$/) { $conn = 1; } if (/^end$/) { $x{$obj}=1 if $xy; $c{$obj}=1 if $conn; } } close(AT); $x{'map'}=1; while(<>) { ($Fld1,$Fld2) = split(' ', $_, 9999); if (/^arch /) { $arch=$Fld2; $spseen=0; } if (/^sp /) { if(defined($x{$arch})) { printf("%s", $_); $spseen=1; } if(defined($c{$arch})) { printf("connected %s\n", $Fld2); $spseen=1; } if($spseen==0) { printf("%s", $_); } } else { if (/^end$/) { if($spseen==0 && (defined($x{$arch}) || defined($c{$arch}))) { printf("sp 0\n") if(defined($x{$arch})) ; printf("connected 0\n") if(defined($c{$arch})) ; } } printf("%s", $_); } } From owner-crossfire Wed Aug 11 13:36:38 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Thu, 12 Aug 1993 01:49:44 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from uxc.cso.uiuc.edu by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Thu, 12 Aug 1993 01:49:41 +0200 Received: from haven.slip.uiuc.edu (cuppernell.slip.uiuc.edu) by uxc.cso.uiuc.edu with SMTP id AA12350 (5.67a/IDA-1.5 for ); Wed, 11 Aug 1993 18:49:19 -0500 Message-Id: Subject: public crossfire servers? To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Date: Wed, 11 Aug 93 18:36:38 CDT X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] From: kronvold@lrdc5.lrdc.pitt.edu Status: RO is there a list somewhere of public crossfire servers? ARE there any public crossfire servers? (in the US?) anywhere? excellent game... got me hooked... - Mike -- ---------------------- kronvold@lrdc5.lrdc.pitt.edu ------------------------- Some assembly required. Use only as directed. No other warranty expressed or implied.For recreational use only.All models over 18 years of age. May be too intense for some viewers. As seen on TV. Avoid contact with skin. Keep away from fire or flame. No Canadian coins. Driver does not carry cash. Apply only to affected area. No user-serviceable parts inside. Simulated picture. Edited for television. Penalty for private use. You must be present to win. Stay dry ------------------ This supersedes all previous notices --------------------- From owner-crossfire Tue Aug 10 15:07:44 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Wed, 11 Aug 1993 07:07:52 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from halcyon.com (chinook.halcyon.com) by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Wed, 11 Aug 1993 07:07:49 +0200 Received: by halcyon.com id AA18770 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for crossfire@ifi.uio.no); Tue, 10 Aug 1993 22:07:44 -0700 Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1993 22:07:44 -0700 From: Jonathan Roy Message-Id: <199308110507.AA18770@halcyon.com> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no, rgg@aaii.oz.au Subject: Re: crossfire bandwidth Status: RO You could make crossfire tick-based, where each second ne move happens... Not as fun as real-time, but it'd be an option for alarge 150 user crossfire game... Latency would be less of a concern.. From owner-crossfire Wed Aug 11 21:21:46 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Wed, 11 Aug 1993 03:22:14 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from eden-valley.aaii.oz.AU by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Wed, 11 Aug 1993 03:22:03 +0200 Received: by eden-valley.aaii.oz.AU (5.65c/SMI-4.0/AAII) id AA13318; Wed, 11 Aug 1993 11:21:46 +1000 Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1993 11:21:46 +1000 From: Rupert G. Goldie Message-Id: <199308110121.AA13318@eden-valley.aaii.oz.AU> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: crossfire bandwidth Status: RO I just tried a little experiment with my linux notebook which is connected to my workstation over a serial line at 19200 bps + compression. I ran crossfire on my workstation and displayed it on my notebook. It is totally playable with no noticeable slowness, even with a screen full of monsters and spells. As an aside, it is actually faster to run crossfire on the workstation and display it on my notebook than to run it on the notebook. So I don't think we have a problem with network bandwidth for crossfire. Latency is another issue entirely, but there just ain't much you can do about it if you want interactive performance 8-( Rupert -- Rupert G. Goldie, Research Scientist rgg@aaii.oz.au Australian Artificial Intelligence Institute /\/\|| 1 Grattan Street, Melbourne, Australia From owner-crossfire Tue Aug 10 17:11:13 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Tue, 10 Aug 1993 15:08:28 +0200 Return-Path: <@vm1.ulg.ac.be:quinet@montefiore.ulg.ac.be> Received: from vm1.ulg.ac.be by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Tue, 10 Aug 1993 15:07:47 +0200 Received: from montefiore.ulg.ac.be by vm1.ulg.ac.be (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with TCP; Tue, 10 Aug 93 15:06:44 +0200 Received: from montefiore.montefiore.ulg.ac.be by montefiore.ulg.ac.be (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA19475; Tue, 10 Aug 93 15:11:13 +0200 Date: Tue, 10 Aug 93 15:11:13 +0200 From: quinet@montefiore.ulg.ac.be (Raphael Quinet) Message-Id: <9308101311.AA19475@montefiore.ulg.ac.be> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: TCP vs. X Window Cc: quinet@montefiore.ulg.ac.be Status: RO Is crossfire going to use the TCP protocol one of these days ? Here are a few advantages and disadvantages of this approach : - Lower bandwidth. If the necessary information is stuffed in a few packets, the game will use the network more efficiently than the X Window protocol. - If we still use the `client-server' technique, much of the work could be done by the clients. Naturally, the graphical interface and the I/O would be managed by the client. But the inventory and the vital stats could also be left on the client side. If fact, the maps and the interactions between the players could be the only things handled by the server. - It's not easy to decide wich kind of information should be put in the packets, and how. This will certainly require a great amount of rewriting. - If the maps are readable by any `client', these is no need for a `server' : it's possible to create a truly distributed game. I tried this technique with a friend, for a game that was to be called `xhover' (a multiplayer, 3-D graphical hovercraft battle simulator - no kidding !). Our project is at rest for the moment, due to some problems in 3-D graphics speed, but the communication part is fully working. There are some robust `login' and `logout' procedures that allow any new client to connect during the game. Each client keeps the others informed of its player's motions and there's a good level of synchronism. And there is no need for a `server' : the game lasts as long as there is at least one process running. If we have done it for our arcade game, this could be done for crossfire ;-). - If we use a robust protocol, the game could survive a X-server or host crash. This is *very* useful if there are 30+ players in a game : if, for some reason, one workstation goes down, most of the players would be unaffected. But the `graceful degradation' is not the easier part of the protocol... Raphael Quinet From owner-crossfire Sun Aug 22 22:39:58 1993 Return-Path: Received: from localhost by ifi.uio.no id ; Sun, 22 Aug 1993 16:51:39 +0200 Received: from Athena.MIT.EDU by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id ; Sun, 22 Aug 1993 16:51:36 +0200 From: kipster@Athena.MIT.EDU Received: from VENUS.MIT.EDU by Athena.MIT.EDU with SMTP id AA25490; Sun, 22 Aug 93 10:51:34 EDT Received: by venus (5.57/4.7) id AA11860; Sun, 22 Aug 93 10:51:28 -0400 Message-Id: <9308221451.AA11860@venus> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: subscribe Date: Sun, 22 Aug 93 10:51:27 EDT Status: RO From f.t.johansen@usit.uio.no Fri Aug 20 21:22:15 1993 Return-Path: Received: from pat.uio.no by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id ; Fri, 20 Aug 1993 21:22:14 +0200 Received: from ulrik.uio.no by pat.uio.no with local-SMTP (PP) id <29296-0@pat.uio.no>; Fri, 20 Aug 1993 21:22:11 +0200 Received: by bilbo ; Fri, 20 Aug 1993 21:22:11 +0200 Received: from ifi.uio.no by pat.uio.no with SMTP (PP) id <10324-0@pat.uio.no>; Thu, 19 Aug 1993 08:36:46 +0200 Received: from localhost by ifi.uio.no id ; Thu, 19 Aug 1993 08:36:15 +0200 Received: from whirlwind.berkeley.edu by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id ; Thu, 19 Aug 1993 08:36:10 +0200 Received: by whirlwind.berkeley.edu (5.65c/CHAOS) id AA02937; Wed, 18 Aug 1993 23:35:36 -0700 Message-Id: <199308190635.AA02937@whirlwind.berkeley.edu> To: "Kevin H. Weiss" Cc: crossfire@ifi.uio.no, mehlhaff@whirlwind.berkeley.edu Subject: Re: Hacking server code. I need help! In-Reply-To: Message from "Kevin H. Weiss" of Mon, 16 Aug 93 11:39:24 <9308161539.AA03971@sonja.math.Virginia.EDU> Date: Wed, 18 Aug 93 23:35:28 PDT From: "'Evil' ERic Mehlhaff" Sender: f.t.johansen@usit.uio.no Status: RO "Kevin H. Weiss" recently wrote: >Right now my server, sonja.math.Virginia.EDU, brings people back from the >dead, restoring from the last save. However, it seems as though such >immortality is and will be abused. I assume you got this coded in? I'm planning on implementing a raise dead spell (you cast on gravestones), and think working from your code would be a good start. What'd you have to do? >1) when you die, your character loses 10% of experience > >2) when restored from death, your character has an empty inventory. When they die, save with save_player(foo,1); I assume you got this already, though. PS, a lot of our players have been trying out your server, and rather like it. Its alot faster than the one we have on soda.berkeley.edu (it may be a fast multiprocessor machine, but crossfire is a single process, so we can't go any faster than a single 16mhz 386 :-( ) On the other hand, we have a few cool hacks... ERic mehlhaff, mehlhaff@ocf.Berkeley.EDU From f.t.johansen@usit.uio.no Fri Aug 20 18:12:09 1993 Return-Path: Received: from pat.uio.no by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id ; Fri, 20 Aug 1993 18:12:09 +0200 Received: from ulrik.uio.no by pat.uio.no with local-SMTP (PP) id <20820-0@pat.uio.no>; Fri, 20 Aug 1993 18:11:54 +0200 Received: by bilbo ; Fri, 20 Aug 1993 18:11:53 +0200 Received: from ifi.uio.no by pat.uio.no with SMTP (PP) id <01514-0@pat.uio.no>; Tue, 17 Aug 1993 03:45:26 +0200 Received: from localhost by ifi.uio.no id ; Tue, 17 Aug 1993 03:42:41 +0200 Received: from hairball.ecst.csuchico.edu by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id ; Tue, 17 Aug 1993 03:42:37 +0200 Received: by hairball.ecst.csuchico.edu (1.37.109.4/16.2) id AA05182; Mon, 16 Aug 93 18:40:47 -0700 From: Tyler Van Gorder Message-Id: <9308170140.AA05182@hairball.ecst.csuchico.edu> Subject: Re: supporting > PseudoColor displays... To: anthony@aaii.oz.au (Anthony Baxter) Date: Mon, 16 Aug 93 18:40:47 PDT Cc: crossfire@ifi.uio.no In-Reply-To: <199308161207.AA17801@eden-valley.aaii.oz.AU>; from "Anthony Baxter" at Aug 16, 93 10:07 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Sender: f.t.johansen@usit.uio.no Status: RO > > Well, in some rigorous testing (ie, I ran it, it popped up windows fine :) > I checked that changing from == PseudoColor to >= PseudoColor in xutil.c > works fine, and means you get a color display. Someone with access to the > One True Source Tree want to whip that change in? (hint, hint! :) > > > Anthony > Cool....I was the one that orignally wrote the color allocation routines..and i have meant for some time to optimize the routine/support more color types. but alas I just haven't had the time. :< but i will try to work on it and get it to frank. Also the other thing i would like to add to the color routine is to instead or allocating colors in the default map...is to find the closest match to our colors that may already be allocated. and also...does anybody have time to move that huge array in color.h into the archetypes file??? it probably should be done...but of course...that is a lot of time....to move all those numbers :> Tyler. tvangod@ecst.csuchico.edu From f.t.johansen@usit.uio.no Fri Aug 20 18:12:06 1993 Return-Path: Received: from pat.uio.no by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id ; Fri, 20 Aug 1993 18:12:05 +0200 Received: from ulrik.uio.no by pat.uio.no with local-SMTP (PP) id <20804-0@pat.uio.no>; Fri, 20 Aug 1993 18:11:45 +0200 Received: by bilbo ; Fri, 20 Aug 1993 18:11:44 +0200 Received: from ifi.uio.no by pat.uio.no with SMTP (PP) id <01514-0@pat.uio.no>; Tue, 17 Aug 1993 03:45:26 +0200 Received: from localhost by ifi.uio.no id ; Tue, 17 Aug 1993 03:42:41 +0200 Received: from hairball.ecst.csuchico.edu by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id ; Tue, 17 Aug 1993 03:42:37 +0200 Received: by hairball.ecst.csuchico.edu (1.37.109.4/16.2) id AA05182; Mon, 16 Aug 93 18:40:47 -0700 From: Tyler Van Gorder Message-Id: <9308170140.AA05182@hairball.ecst.csuchico.edu> Subject: Re: supporting > PseudoColor displays... To: anthony@aaii.oz.au (Anthony Baxter) Date: Mon, 16 Aug 93 18:40:47 PDT Cc: crossfire@ifi.uio.no In-Reply-To: <199308161207.AA17801@eden-valley.aaii.oz.AU>; from "Anthony Baxter" at Aug 16, 93 10:07 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Sender: f.t.johansen@usit.uio.no Status: RO > > Well, in some rigorous testing (ie, I ran it, it popped up windows fine :) > I checked that changing from == PseudoColor to >= PseudoColor in xutil.c > works fine, and means you get a color display. Someone with access to the > One True Source Tree want to whip that change in? (hint, hint! :) > > > Anthony > Cool....I was the one that orignally wrote the color allocation routines..and i have meant for some time to optimize the routine/support more color types. but alas I just haven't had the time. :< but i will try to work on it and get it to frank. Also the other thing i would like to add to the color routine is to instead or allocating colors in the default map...is to find the closest match to our colors that may already be allocated. and also...does anybody have time to move that huge array in color.h into the archetypes file??? it probably should be done...but of course...that is a lot of time....to move all those numbers :> Tyler. tvangod@ecst.csuchico.edu From f.t.johansen@usit.uio.no Fri Aug 20 18:11:14 1993 Return-Path: Received: from pat.uio.no by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id ; Fri, 20 Aug 1993 18:11:13 +0200 Received: from ulrik.uio.no by pat.uio.no with local-SMTP (PP) id <20680-0@pat.uio.no>; Fri, 20 Aug 1993 18:10:56 +0200 Received: by bilbo ; Fri, 20 Aug 1993 18:10:54 +0200 Received: from ifi.uio.no by pat.uio.no with SMTP (PP) id <10687-0@pat.uio.no>; Mon, 16 Aug 1993 18:37:42 +0200 Received: from localhost by ifi.uio.no id for ; Mon, 16 Aug 1993 18:35:34 +0200 Received: from chenas.inria.fr by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Mon, 16 Aug 1993 18:35:28 +0200 Received: from matell.enst-bretagne.fr ([192.108.115.2]) by chenas.inria.fr (5.65c8d/92.02.29) via Fnet-EUnet id AA02225; Mon, 16 Aug 1993 18:35:24 +0200 (MET) Received: from enstb.enst-bretagne.fr (enstb-gw) by matell.enst-bretagne.fr (5.65cd/120893); Mon, 16 Aug 1993 18:36:50 GMT Received: from leibniz.enst-bretagne.fr by enstb.enst-bretagne.fr (5.65c8/180193); Mon, 16 Aug 1993 18:34:57 +0200 Date: Mon, 16 Aug 1993 18:34:57 +0200 From: monfret@enstb.enst-bretagne.fr ( J-Christophe MONFRET ) Message-Id: <199308161634.AA28156@enstb.enst-bretagne.fr> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: Hacking server code. I need help! X-Charset: LATIN1 X-Char-Esc: 29 Sender: f.t.johansen@usit.uio.no Status: RO Just a simple C file that empty a character. When a character die just run this program with the filename of the character. I think it would be very easy to integrate it directly in the game. you can also add the loss of experience in it. JC. #include #include char buf[255]=""; char shoottype[]="shoottype"; char fin[]="end\n"; char known_spell[]="known_spell"; char map[]="map"; char coordx[]="x"; char coordy[]="y"; char gen_hp[]="gen_hp"; char gen_sp[]="gen_sp"; char attac[]="attacktype"; char file_temp[]="tmp.fic"; FILE *fichier_pl; FILE *fichier_temp; resur(nom_fichier) char *nom_fichier; { char *retour=""; fichier_pl=fopen(nom_fichier, "rb"); fichier_temp=fopen(file_temp, "wb"); fgets(buf, 255, fichier_pl); while (strncmp(buf, shoottype, strlen(shoottype))) { if (!strncmp(buf, gen_hp, strlen(gen_hp))) fprintf(fichier_temp, "gen_hp 0\n"); else if (!strncmp(buf, gen_sp, strlen(gen_sp))) fprintf(fichier_temp, "gen_sp 0\n"); else { fprintf(fichier_temp, "%s", buf); } fgets(buf, 255, fichier_pl); } fprintf(fichier_temp, "shoottype 0\n"); fgets(buf, 255, fichier_pl); while (strncmp(buf, fin, strlen(fin))) { if (strncmp(buf, known_spell, strlen(known_spell))) { if (!strncmp(buf, map, strlen(map))) fprintf(fichier_temp, "map 4\n"); else if (!strncmp(buf, coordx, strlen(coordx))) fprintf(fichier_temp, "x 20\n"); else if (!strncmp(buf, coordy, strlen(coordy))) fprintf(fichier_temp, "y 20\n"); else if (!strncmp(buf, attac, strlen(attac))) fprintf(fichier_temp, "attacktype 1\n"); else fprintf(fichier_temp, "%s", buf); } fgets(buf, 255, fichier_pl); } fprintf(fichier_temp, "%s", buf); fclose(fichier_pl); fclose(fichier_temp); fichier_pl=fopen(nom_fichier, "wb"); fichier_temp=fopen(file_temp, "rb"); fgets(buf, 255, fichier_temp); while (retour!=NULL) { fprintf(fichier_pl, "%s", buf); retour=fgets(buf, 255, fichier_temp); } fclose(fichier_pl); fclose(fichier_temp); } main(int argc, char *argv[]) { resur(argv[1]); } From owner-crossfire Mon Aug 16 03:05:07 1993 Return-Path: Received: from localhost by ifi.uio.no id for uio.no; Mon, 16 Aug 1993 03:05:07 +0200 Received: from eden-valley.aaii.oz.AU by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for uio.no; Mon, 16 Aug 1993 03:04:52 +0200 Received: from chook.aaii.oz.AU by eden-valley.aaii.oz.AU with SMTP (5.65c/SMI-4.0/AAII) id AA03772; Mon, 16 Aug 1993 11:03:39 +1000 Message-Id: <199308160103.AA03772@eden-valley.aaii.oz.AU> To: ftww@orthanc.cs.su.oz.au (Geoff Bailey) Cc: crossfire@ifi.uio.no In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 16 Aug 1993 10:33:20 +1000." <199308160033.12900.ifi@ifi.uio.no> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 16 Aug 1993 11:03:55 +1000 From: Anthony Baxter Status: RO you write: > > Looking at the code, changing it to '>= PseudoColor' shouldn't cause any > problems. At worst it will bail out to monochrome again. In fact, it might > be an idea to change it to '>= StaticColor', as the same applies to that too. > (Anybody got a StaticColor display?) Well, according to 'xdpyinfo', this thing here on my desk can support class: StaticGray depth: 8 planes class: GrayScale depth: 8 planes class: StaticColor depth: 8 planes class: PseudoColor depth: 8 planes class: TrueColor depth: 8 planes class: TrueColor depth: 24 planes class: DirectColor depth: 24 planes So, assuming I can work out how to make it run the Xserver in a mode apart from PseudoColor :-) I can test this stuff, I guess... Anthony From owner-crossfire Mon Aug 16 02:33:37 1993 Return-Path: Received: from localhost by ifi.uio.no id for uio.no; Mon, 16 Aug 1993 02:33:37 +0200 Received: from joyce.cs.su.OZ.AU by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for uio.no; Mon, 16 Aug 1993 02:33:31 +0200 Message-Id: <199308160033.12900.ifi@ifi.uio.no> Received: from orthanc.cs.su.OZ.AU by joyce.cs.su.OZ.AU (for crossfire@ifi.uio.no) with MHSnet; Mon, 16 Aug 1993 10:33:27 +1000 Date: Mon, 16 Aug 1993 10:33:20 +1000 From: ftww@orthanc.cs.su.OZ.AU (Geoff Bailey) To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Status: RO Subject: Re: True Color To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Date: Mon, 16 Aug 93 10:33:20 EST From: Fred the Wonder Worm In-Reply-To: <199308152040.AA24911@cc.lut.fi>; from "Petri Heinil{" at Aug 15, 93 11:40 pm X-Face: )\c`u_%V|7EQUDUt%5v'IJ?=@^Wf^<#,~CjzL`/2q0=-O6XW/Z8A2j.kgg:| 7|YZPSxy}rIuw8qD|/cQZ9^6kb:1XLleXhOl-U>(c~d`bC)%7FItZOUEw?=x%TBQ~NFJ,U|3wi[jzXd5-bMC Reply-To: ftww@cs.su.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.2 PL0] > From: Petri Heinila > > ... > >From: Kjetil Torgrim Homme > > ... > >Sounds like good idea to add support for TrueColor if nothing more is > >needed :-) If it works for you, it will probably work for others. Are > >there anyone here with access to a DirectColor display? Does anyone > >know what that means? > > I have no access :( ,but isn`t it that there is direct RGB mapping to > screen. In 24-bit display there is 8-bits to each component mapped > straigth to dummy lookup-table to screen. Yes. In DirectColor, there is a lookup table for each component (red/green/blue) whereas PseudoColor only has a lookup table for the actual pixel value. Looking at the code, changing it to '>= PseudoColor' shouldn't cause any problems. At worst it will bail out to monochrome again. In fact, it might be an idea to change it to '>= StaticColor', as the same applies to that too. (Anybody got a StaticColor display?) Cheers, Geoff. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Geoff Bailey (Fred the Wonder Worm) | Programmer by trade -- ftww@cs.su.oz.au | Gameplayer by vocation. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-crossfire Sun Aug 15 22:40:19 1993 Return-Path: Received: from localhost by ifi.uio.no id for uio.no; Sun, 15 Aug 1993 22:40:19 +0200 Received: from cc.lut.fi by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for uio.no; Sun, 15 Aug 1993 22:40:16 +0200 Received: by cc.lut.fi (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4/Kim-2.2) id AA24911; Sun, 15 Aug 1993 23:40:15 +0300 Date: Sun, 15 Aug 1993 23:40:15 +0300 From: Petri Heinil{ Message-Id: <199308152040.AA24911@cc.lut.fi> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: True Color Status: RO >From: Kjetil Torgrim Homme > ... >Sounds like good idea to add support for TrueColor if nothing more is >needed :-) If it works for you, it will probably work for others. Are >there anyone here with access to a DirectColor display? Does anyone >know what that means? I have no access :( ,but isn`t it that there is direct RGB mapping to screen. In 24-bit display there is 8-bits to each component mapped straigth to dummy lookup-table to screen. //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// // Petri Heinila // email: Petri.Heinila@lut.fi // // // mail: Ainonkatu 2A // // // 53100 Lappeenranta // // // Finland, Europe // //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// From owner-crossfire Sun Aug 15 22:24:56 1993 Return-Path: Received: from localhost by ifi.uio.no id for uio.no; Sun, 15 Aug 1993 22:24:56 +0200 Received: from gymir.ifi.uio.no by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for uio.no; Sun, 15 Aug 1993 22:24:54 +0200 From: Kjetil Torgrim Homme Received: by gymir.ifi.uio.no ; Sun, 15 Aug 1993 22:24:54 +0200 Date: Sun, 15 Aug 1993 22:24:54 +0200 Message-Id: <19930815202454.8862.gymir@ifi.uio.no> To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no In-Reply-To: Michael Glenn's message of Sun, 15 Aug 93 04:14:04 -0400 <9308150814.AA02466@fermat.dartmouth.edu> Subject: Re: True Color Status: RO Sounds like good idea to add support for TrueColor if nothing more is needed :-) If it works for you, it will probably work for others. Are there anyone here with access to a DirectColor display? Does anyone know what that means? Kjetil T. From owner-crossfire Sun Aug 15 00:14:04 1993 Received: by ifi.uio.no id for crossfire.alias; Sun, 15 Aug 1993 10:15:40 +0200 Return-Path: Received: from dartvax.dartmouth.edu by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id for ; Sun, 15 Aug 1993 10:15:37 +0200 Received: from fermat.dartmouth.edu by dartvax.dartmouth.edu (5.65+D5/4.5HUB) id AA01903; Sun, 15 Aug 93 04:15:34 -0400 Received: by fermat.dartmouth.edu (NX5.67d/NX3.0S) id AA02466; Sun, 15 Aug 93 04:14:04 -0400 Date: Sun, 15 Aug 93 04:14:04 -0400 From: Michael Glenn Message-Id: <9308150814.AA02466@fermat.dartmouth.edu> Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.95) Received: by NeXT Mailer (1.95) To: crossfire@ifi.uio.no Subject: True Color Status: RO I was just sitting here sadly playing crossfire in black and white on my true color machine, when I got an evil idea. What would happen if I changed "== PseudoColor" in common/xutil.c to ">= PseudoColor"? I tried it. Poof! Instant color! :) I don't suppose this will cause any problems? (If not, how about putting this fix in?) Michael